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Krem
Cream of the Crop
Joined: Wed Nov 29, 2006 8:04 pm Posts: 2035 Location: Citizens Bank Park
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 Re: Russia invading Ukraine?
On a side note, I love how every Putin apologist is all of a sudden an expert on Ukrainian law and Constitution.
_________________ Let's go Phillies.
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Tue Mar 04, 2014 6:19 pm |
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Darth Indiana Bond
007
Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2005 11:43 pm Posts: 11613 Location: Wouldn't you like to know
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 Re: Russia invading Ukraine?
Krem wrote: So much stupid in this thread If you could please elaborate, for outside of one, maybe two posters, most posts in this thread seem to share your perspective.
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Tue Mar 04, 2014 7:24 pm |
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Krem
Cream of the Crop
Joined: Wed Nov 29, 2006 8:04 pm Posts: 2035 Location: Citizens Bank Park
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 Re: Russia invading Ukraine?
Darth Indiana Bond wrote: Krem wrote: So much stupid in this thread If you could please elaborate, for outside of one, maybe two posters, most posts in this thread seem to share your perspective. Well, you have Mr R who is eager to restore Russian control over all of former USSR, actual people be damned. Then you have Chippy, Magnus and Algren being themselves. For someone like me, with family and friends who live in Ukraine and have to live with the consequences of Putin's czar complex, this is a bit too much.
_________________ Let's go Phillies.
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Tue Mar 04, 2014 9:08 pm |
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Jedi Master Carr
Extraordinary
Joined: Fri Nov 11, 2005 9:51 pm Posts: 11637
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 Re: Russia invading Ukraine?
I would say it happened after more because Putin wouldn't allowed sending Russian troops into Ukraine during the Olympics. It would have made him look bad. I do think this situation was building over the last few months and was going to happen. Things do seem to be cooling over there for the moment. I am hoping Putin is seeing things are going his way. Unless his whole plan was just to get Crimea.
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Wed Mar 05, 2014 1:36 am |
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Chippy
KJ's Leading Pundit
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 4:45 pm Posts: 63026 Location: Tonight... YOU!
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 Re: Russia invading Ukraine?
I made 2 jokes and one serious post. Which is legitimate. F you, Krem!
_________________trixster wrote: shut the fuck up zwackerm, you're out of your fucking element trixster wrote: chippy is correct
Last edited by Chippy on Wed Mar 05, 2014 6:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Wed Mar 05, 2014 10:33 am |
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Mr. R
Cream of the Crop
Joined: Mon Feb 20, 2006 3:19 pm Posts: 2231
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 Re: Russia invading Ukraine?
[quote
Last edited by Mr. R on Sat Aug 23, 2014 10:13 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Fri Mar 07, 2014 1:54 pm |
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Mr. R
Cream of the Crop
Joined: Mon Feb 20, 2006 3:19 pm Posts: 2231
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 Re: Russia invading Ukraine?
[quote
Last edited by Mr. R on Sat Aug 23, 2014 10:13 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Fri Mar 07, 2014 2:24 pm |
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Krem
Cream of the Crop
Joined: Wed Nov 29, 2006 8:04 pm Posts: 2035 Location: Citizens Bank Park
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 Re: Russia invading Ukraine?
Mr. R wrote: I've heard about it, but I live near Moscow and I have Dozhd' on cable - care to comment? I don't know who's taken them off the air, but they enraged a lot of people, stating Leningrad should have been given up to nazis - that's what got them into trouble. But again, I live near Moscow and I have Dozhd' on cable First of all, they never said that, they ran a poll asking the viewers that question. It might be inflammatory, sure, but it's a question that many historians have asked as well. It's not a black and white answer. It is very convenient for the Putin regime to use it to silence the only channel that airs opposition vies. Second, I said most major cable providers, not all. Stop being coy by saying that just because you have it there is no issue. You can read the list of operators that shut it off here: http://www.kommersant.ru/doc/2404738Mr. R wrote: P.S. According to the treaty between Ukraine and Russia, we are allowed to keep 25K troops in Crimea. Way more than there is now. Right Sector promised to send "a friendship train" to take care of the Crimea trouble. Should we have waited for the bloodbath? Yes, Russian troops can be in Crimea - but on Russian bases, not on Ukrainian soil, blocking access to Ukrainian civil and military objects - which is what they're doing right now. Of course, according to your president those are not Russian troops at all - they're just some random guys who happen to be wearing Russian issue uniform, driving Russian tanks and using Russian army weapons. But not Russian troops. As for Right Sector - I'm not going to deny that there aren't issues with far-right nationalism in Ukraine, but the Russian government blows them out of proportion for its own gain. Let's not forget that since the breakup of the Soviet Union, Ukraine has led a peaceful existence with no terrorism or national division issues, while Russia has had two civil wars fought on its soil and countless terrorist attacks. We do not need your patronizing attitude towards bloodbaths - go fix your own messes.
_________________ Let's go Phillies.
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Fri Mar 07, 2014 4:35 pm |
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Krem
Cream of the Crop
Joined: Wed Nov 29, 2006 8:04 pm Posts: 2035 Location: Citizens Bank Park
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 Re: Russia invading Ukraine?
Mr. R wrote: I'm not, but if something I said is not right - please disprove, how come Yanukovich is not legitimate (if he's not dead, didn't resign, and wasn't impeached) and decisions of the Rada are? Why was there no impeachment? Why wasn't the agreement between him and opposition enforced by the West (i.e. why didn't the West make opposition to act on what they've agreed upon)? Why are the members of the Rada (namely communists and Party of the Regions) threatened by the Right Sector? If Yanukovich is legitimate, and as elected president by international law he fucking is, there's his official appeal to Russia to use army in Ukraine. Yanukovich stopped being a legitimate president the second he fled Kiev and refused to sign the law that would restore the Constitution of 2004 - which he agreed to do according to the February 21st agreement with the opposition. It's tough to talk about legitimacy for a man who has not been seen or heard from in over a week.
_________________ Let's go Phillies.
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Fri Mar 07, 2014 4:49 pm |
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Krem
Cream of the Crop
Joined: Wed Nov 29, 2006 8:04 pm Posts: 2035 Location: Citizens Bank Park
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 Re: Russia invading Ukraine?
Mr. R wrote: I want Belarus, Malorossiya and Novorossiya to be united in one state Great Russia, which will happen in the next 10 years. I don't want to see Western Ukraine with us - let them join Poland and Romania, and I don't care about the Eastern block. I want "non-citizen" Russians from Baltic states to move to Russia. In the next 20 years I want us to be in Eurasian Union with other former Soviet republics (including united Bessarabia) + China, Turkey, Iran, Syria, Serbia and Mongolia. Really, you can stop right there and save us all from your mental gymnastics justifying Russia's behavior and coming up with quasi-legal excuses for why the government in Ukraine is illegitimate. You simply want USSR back, without at all trying to understand the forces that tore it apart in the first place. Comrade Putin is proud of your service on the Internet.
_________________ Let's go Phillies.
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Fri Mar 07, 2014 4:52 pm |
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Dr. Lecter
You must have big rats
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 4:28 pm Posts: 92093 Location: Bonn, Germany
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 Re: Russia invading Ukraine?
Mr. R wrote: I want Belarus, Malorossiya and Novorossiya to be united in one state Great Russia, which will happen in the next 10 years. I don't want to see Western Ukraine with us - let them join Poland and Romania, and I don't care about the Eastern block. I want "non-citizen" Russians from Baltic states to move to Russia. In the next 20 years I want us to be in Eurasian Union with other former Soviet republics (including united Bessarabia) + China, Turkey, Iran, Syria, Serbia and Mongolia.
I've gotta give you one thing - unlike Putin, you are actually honest and blunt about what you want and hope to happen. That being said, I sincerely hope that will never happen. The way Russia is going, no surprise that in the past 15 years I never ever felt the desire of going back there, even for a visit.
_________________The greatest thing on earth is to love and to be loved in return!
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Fri Mar 07, 2014 8:14 pm |
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Krem
Cream of the Crop
Joined: Wed Nov 29, 2006 8:04 pm Posts: 2035 Location: Citizens Bank Park
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 Re: Russia invading Ukraine?
Dr. Lecter wrote: Mr. R wrote: I want Belarus, Malorossiya and Novorossiya to be united in one state Great Russia, which will happen in the next 10 years. I don't want to see Western Ukraine with us - let them join Poland and Romania, and I don't care about the Eastern block. I want "non-citizen" Russians from Baltic states to move to Russia. In the next 20 years I want us to be in Eurasian Union with other former Soviet republics (including united Bessarabia) + China, Turkey, Iran, Syria, Serbia and Mongolia.
I've gotta give you one thing - unlike Putin, you are actually honest and blunt about what you want and hope to happen. That being said, I sincerely hope that will never happen. The way Russia is going, no surprise that in the past 15 years I never ever felt the desire of going back there, even for a visit. Putin does say that, just in slightly more diplomatic terms. But actions speak louder than words.
_________________ Let's go Phillies.
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Fri Mar 07, 2014 9:19 pm |
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Mr. R
Cream of the Crop
Joined: Mon Feb 20, 2006 3:19 pm Posts: 2231
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 Re: Russia invading Ukraine?
[quote
Last edited by Mr. R on Sat Aug 23, 2014 10:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Sat Mar 08, 2014 3:34 am |
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Mr. R
Cream of the Crop
Joined: Mon Feb 20, 2006 3:19 pm Posts: 2231
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 Re: Russia invading Ukraine?
[quote
Last edited by Mr. R on Sat Aug 23, 2014 10:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Sat Mar 08, 2014 3:40 am |
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Mr. R
Cream of the Crop
Joined: Mon Feb 20, 2006 3:19 pm Posts: 2231
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 Re: Russia invading Ukraine?
[quote
Last edited by Mr. R on Sat Aug 23, 2014 10:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Sat Mar 08, 2014 3:52 am |
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Dr. Lecter
You must have big rats
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 4:28 pm Posts: 92093 Location: Bonn, Germany
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 Re: Russia invading Ukraine?
Mr. R wrote: There's another issue - if Ukraine joins NATO, Russian defense goes to hell. Should we let that happen? Gorbachev was promised that after the unification of Germany, NATO would stop on the German Eastern border. How the fuck did they take Czech Republic, Hungary, Poland, Bulgaria, Baltic states, Romania, Slovakia, Slovenia, Albania, Croatia, plan to take Montenegro, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Georgia and Ukraine? How should we react? How would YOU want you YOUR country to react? That is only assuming that Russia will ever have the need to actually defend itself.
_________________The greatest thing on earth is to love and to be loved in return!
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Sat Mar 08, 2014 9:00 am |
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Caius
A very honest-hearted fellow
Joined: Mon Oct 11, 2004 8:02 pm Posts: 4767
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 Re: Russia invading Ukraine?
Mr. R wrote: There's another issue - if Ukraine joins NATO, Russian defense goes to hell. Should we let that happen? Gorbachev was promised that after the unification of Germany, NATO would stop on the German Eastern border. How the fuck did they take Czech Republic, Hungary, Poland, Bulgaria, Baltic states, Romania, Slovakia, Slovenia, Albania, Croatia, plan to take Montenegro, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Georgia and Ukraine? How should we react? How would YOU want you YOUR country to react? Take is an incorrect word. Those countries want to freely join NATO because they fear Russia. Cf. Georgia and Ukraine and that is the last handful of years. Why do you fear those countries joining NATO or creating agreements with the EU and maybe joining it at a future date? They will still trade with Russia and I am extremely doubtful they will attack it and if they did, they would obviously lose. Plus I doubt most of the member states in NATO would honor treaty obligations unless one of the major NATO powers were attacked. For example, I doubt Albania would get the same treatment as France/Germany/UK/Canada/U.S. would get if they were attacked.
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Sat Mar 08, 2014 1:04 pm |
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Mr. R
Cream of the Crop
Joined: Mon Feb 20, 2006 3:19 pm Posts: 2231
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 Re: Russia invading Ukraine?
[quote
Last edited by Mr. R on Sat Aug 23, 2014 10:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Sat Mar 08, 2014 2:35 pm |
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Mr. R
Cream of the Crop
Joined: Mon Feb 20, 2006 3:19 pm Posts: 2231
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 Re: Russia invading Ukraine?
[quote
Last edited by Mr. R on Sat Aug 23, 2014 10:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Sat Mar 08, 2014 2:55 pm |
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Jedi Master Carr
Extraordinary
Joined: Fri Nov 11, 2005 9:51 pm Posts: 11637
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 Re: Russia invading Ukraine?
you are crazy nobody is attacking Russia because they have nukes. The U.S. or NATO wouldn't attack Russia for the same reason Russia or China for that matter would start a war with them because it would lead to WW3 and with Nuclear War nobody wins but the cockroaches. Also those troops are Russian troops, only a fool would deny that. Journalists from CNN and others have talked to them and one of them even admitted to them they were from Russia.
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Sat Mar 08, 2014 3:45 pm |
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Caius
A very honest-hearted fellow
Joined: Mon Oct 11, 2004 8:02 pm Posts: 4767
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 Re: Russia invading Ukraine?
Mr. R wrote: We hear Russia owes former communist countries hundreds of billions of dollars for the "Soviet occupation" (that's when USSR took resources of Russia and built all infrastructure in those). We hear there's too much territory and resources for one country and for such a small population. Until humanity is stuck on Earth, the big fight for resources is inevitable. It is only a matter of time. If you don't see that - you're blind.
No need for quotation marks. It was an occupation and it is also when you stole other resources (agricultural products and land from Ukraine, for one) and starved populations to death.
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Sat Mar 08, 2014 4:58 pm |
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Dr. Lecter
You must have big rats
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 4:28 pm Posts: 92093 Location: Bonn, Germany
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 Re: Russia invading Ukraine?
Mr. R wrote: Dr. Lecter wrote: That is only assuming that Russia will ever have the need to actually defend itself. NATO bases around our borders are like Soviet missiles on Cuba - we don't want to use it, but, hey, just in case, might come in handy. The only country NATO doesn't take in is Russia, because NATO is against us. And China. They promised Gorbachev they'd stop in Germany. P-R-O-M-I-S-E-D. We don't trust the West anymore, whatever you say. The West destroyed Russian Empire, then Soviet Union, now it wants to destroy Russia. Building a nazi state in Ukraine - that's fucking brilliant! Doc, don't you see that today's Ukraine is Germany in early 1930s, same events, same slogans, same personalities? No, now that you asked it, I actually don't, no.
_________________The greatest thing on earth is to love and to be loved in return!
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Sat Mar 08, 2014 6:35 pm |
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Mr. R
Cream of the Crop
Joined: Mon Feb 20, 2006 3:19 pm Posts: 2231
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 Re: Russia invading Ukraine?
[quote
Last edited by Mr. R on Sat Aug 23, 2014 10:14 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Sun Mar 09, 2014 12:55 am |
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kypade
Kypade
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 10:53 pm Posts: 7908
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 Re: Russia invading Ukraine?
Man this dude really like Russia huh. Chill out, quit Russian to their defense.
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Sun Mar 09, 2014 1:25 am |
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Dr. Lecter
You must have big rats
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 4:28 pm Posts: 92093 Location: Bonn, Germany
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 Re: Russia invading Ukraine?
R, you are a fanatic.
_________________The greatest thing on earth is to love and to be loved in return!
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Sun Mar 09, 2014 6:43 am |
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