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 The Biden era: The Establishment Strikes Back 

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 The Biden era: The Establishment Strikes Back 
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Post Re: The Biden era: The Establishment Strikes Back
Funny how the people who talk about how Trump is a threat to democracy, are upset that the Supreme Court made the abortion issue more democratic, it's now more determined by the voters and their elected congresspeople.

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Mon Jun 27, 2022 3:24 am
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Post Re: The Biden era: The Establishment Strikes Back
Shack wrote:
Funny how the people who talk about how Trump is a threat to democracy, are upset that the Supreme Court made the abortion issue more democratic, it's now more determined by the voters and their elected congresspeople.


There is also the argument that a body of unelected people determined their fate.

However, I am still a huge proponent of the Supreme Court as I like having a body of people who are free the whims of fickle voters. It is important in ensuring the protection of minorities. I just don’t agree with this current Supreme Court as they are dangerously suggesting to ignore precedent which renders previous rulings meaningless.

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Mon Jun 27, 2022 7:54 am
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Post Re: The Biden era: The Establishment Strikes Back
Darth Indiana Bond wrote:
Shack wrote:
Funny how the people who talk about how Trump is a threat to democracy, are upset that the Supreme Court made the abortion issue more democratic, it's now more determined by the voters and their elected congresspeople.


There is also the argument that a body of unelected people determined their fate. The Courts are just as fucked up as Congress/White House.

However, I am still a huge proponent of the Supreme Court as I like having a body of people who are free the whims of fickle voters. It is important in ensuring the protection of minorities. I just don’t agree with this current Supreme Court as they are dangerously suggesting to ignore precedent which renders previous rulings meaningless.


but not free money/influences from radical politicians, extreme evangelicals & corporations.

look at Clarence Thomas... https://www.businessinsider.com/clarenc ... ble-2022-6

Quote:
In a conversation with his law clerks two years following his confirmation, The New York Times reported Thomas expressed his desire to serve on the court until the year 2034.

"The liberals made my life miserable for 43 years," a former clerk remembered Thomas – who was 43 years old when confirmed – saying, according to The New York Times. "And I'm going to make their lives miserable for 43 years."

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Mon Jun 27, 2022 9:37 am
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Post Re: The Biden era: The Establishment Strikes Back
Darth Indiana Bond wrote:
Shack wrote:
Funny how the people who talk about how Trump is a threat to democracy, are upset that the Supreme Court made the abortion issue more democratic, it's now more determined by the voters and their elected congress people.


There is also the argument that a body of unelected people determined their fate.

However, I am still a huge proponent of the Supreme Court as I like having a body of people who are free the whims of fickle voters. It is important in ensuring the protection of minorities. I just don’t agree with this current Supreme Court as they are dangerously suggesting to ignore precedent which renders previous rulings meaningless.


And one of the seats (Gorsuch) was stolen in one of the worst abuses of power ever in the Senate. It's difficult to consider his seat, his vote, legit in any way. It's both surprising (and not, due to lack of spine) that the current DEM controlled Senate (even if it's 50:50) hasn't passed anything to prevent this from happening again. McConnell is on the record (just a couple weeks ago, in fact) saying he'll not consider any Supreme Court nominee if he's majority leader again; he'll keep it at 8 (or less) justices until 2024.

And on the recent Roe decision, all five judges were under oath saying it was settled law, reaffirmed many times, the law of the land, etc. Does that mean they can't vote to overturn it? Of course not. However, why believe what the Supreme Court says when the majority are confirmed liars? Why trust them? What's even the purpose of confirmation hearings (which the Senate doesn't even have to do, they can just vote)? Their image is tainted as the GOP has taken the reigns. They're not really anymore trustworthy than Congress; the line is blurred between Justice and Politician.

Democrats seem to be stuck on "Oh, that won't happen" on these issues, but they've already happened, and will be happening again. "They won't block another SCOTUS seat." (Already saying they will.) SCOTUS won't overturn any other landmark cases. (Already said they will revisit them.) It's embarrassing.

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Mon Jun 27, 2022 1:07 pm
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Post Re: The Biden era: The Establishment Strikes Back
The Democrats are incompetent in governing for sure. I agree Corpse, Gorsuch is arguably an invalid selection due to McConnell robbing Obama from a pick for two whole years. If I were the Democrats, I would fix this, 100% agree.

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Mon Jun 27, 2022 1:12 pm
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Post Re: The Biden era: The Establishment Strikes Back
Mitch McConnell is a hero for keeping judicial activist Merrick Garland off the supreme court. He should have been honest and said that was the real reason for keeping him off, but it's good that he kept him off nonetheless.


Mon Jun 27, 2022 1:16 pm
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Post Re: The Biden era: The Establishment Strikes Back
zwackerm wrote:
Mitch McConnell is a hero for keeping judicial activist Merrick Garland off the supreme court. He should have been honest and said that was the real reason for keeping him off, but it's good that he kept him off nonetheless.


Disrupting a President of his Constitutional duty? Tainting the legitimacy of the Senate and the Supreme Court?

At least you're being honest and saying it's to push one ideological belief as right over another. But any respect is basically gone for you; you see things through a "this way or that way" lens of black and white.

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“Gods are great ... but the heart is greater. For it is from our hearts they come, and to our hearts they shall return.”
“We were like gods at the dawning of the world, & our joy was so bright we could see nothing else but the other.”
“There are three things all wise men fear: the sea in storm, a night with no moon, and the anger of a gentle man.”
“You have to pretend you get an endgame. You have to carry on like you will; otherwise, you can't carry on at all.”
"Paper is dead without words / Ink idle without a poem / All the world dead without stories."


Mon Jun 27, 2022 1:20 pm
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Post Re: The Biden era: The Establishment Strikes Back
Darth Indiana Bond wrote:
The Democrats are incompetent in governing for sure. I agree Corpse, Gorsuch is arguably an invalid selection due to McConnell robbing Obama from a pick for two whole years. If I were the Democrats, I would fix this, 100% agree.

Two years? Didn't he die 9 months before the election?

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Mon Jun 27, 2022 1:33 pm
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Post Re: The Biden era: The Establishment Strikes Back
zwackerm wrote:
Mitch McConnell is a hero for keeping judicial activist Merrick Garland off the supreme court. He should have been honest and said that was the real reason for keeping him off, but it's good that he kept him off nonetheless.


Tbf I'm guessing he didn't know Merrick Garland was this much of a radical leftist, and the reason he didn't confirm him compared to Obama's previous picks that went on to be activist judges was the timing, but either way, it worked out ok in retrospect with Garland going on to show his real colors

It was a little bit of a dirty move by McConnell, but I feel pretty confident saying that if a supreme court justice died in February 2008 when the Republicans were obviously going to lose the election, the Democrats would've found it unfair if lame duck Bush got to appoint someone.

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Mon Jun 27, 2022 1:43 pm
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Post Re: The Biden era: The Establishment Strikes Back
Corpse wrote:
zwackerm wrote:
Mitch McConnell is a hero for keeping judicial activist Merrick Garland off the supreme court. He should have been honest and said that was the real reason for keeping him off, but it's good that he kept him off nonetheless.


Disrupting a President of his Constitutional duty? Tainting the legitimacy of the Senate and the Supreme Court?

At least you're being honest and saying it's to push one ideological belief as right over another. But any respect is basically gone for you; you see things through a "this way or that way" lens of black and white.


The senate is not obligated to confirm incompetent judges. If Obama had nominated someone who would actually interpret the constitution rather than insert whatever ideological desires the Democrat president had, there's a strong chance they would have been confirmed.


Mon Jun 27, 2022 2:04 pm
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Post Re: The Biden era: The Establishment Strikes Back
zwackerm wrote:
Corpse wrote:
zwackerm wrote:
Mitch McConnell is a hero for keeping judicial activist Merrick Garland off the supreme court. He should have been honest and said that was the real reason for keeping him off, but it's good that he kept him off nonetheless.


Disrupting a President of his Constitutional duty? Tainting the legitimacy of the Senate and the Supreme Court?

At least you're being honest and saying it's to push one ideological belief as right over another. But any respect is basically gone for you; you see things through a "this way or that way" lens of black and white.


The senate is not obligated to confirm incompetent judges. If Obama had nominated someone who would actually interpret the constitution rather than insert whatever ideological desires the Democrat president had, there's a strong chance they would have been confirmed.
:funny: :funny: :funny: :funny: This is the most absurd thing I've read amongst an ocean of absurdity these last few days. Barack Obama could have nominated Ronald Reagan and it would have been shut down once McConnell figured out that he could do it and face absolutely zero consequences since republican voters place zero value on moral integrity.

This is why democracy is dying. Delusional kookers will justify any obstruction of justice so long as fits their baseless fantasies.


Mon Jun 27, 2022 2:09 pm
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Post Re: The Biden era: The Establishment Strikes Back
You could also argue that Obama could have negotiated with McConnell for someone halfway in between Garland and Gorsuch in terms of their views. McConnell would have been motivated to hedge because of the high chance in early 2016 that the Republicans were going to lose to Hillary hence getting someone with roughly Roberts views while he can possibly would've been in his interest compared to losing and having Garland. But Obama probably didn't want to compromise with a Roberts type judge because he assumed Hillary was going to beat Trump, and who can blame him.

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Post Re: The Biden era: The Establishment Strikes Back
Shack wrote:
zwackerm wrote:
Mitch McConnell is a hero for keeping judicial activist Merrick Garland off the supreme court. He should have been honest and said that was the real reason for keeping him off, but it's good that he kept him off nonetheless.


Tbf I'm guessing he didn't know Merrick Garland was this much of a radical leftist, and the reason he didn't confirm him compared to Obama's previous picks that went on to be activist judges was the timing, but either way, it worked out ok in retrospect with Garland going on to show his real colors

It was a little bit of a dirty move by McConnell, but I feel pretty confident saying that if a supreme court justice died in February 2008 when the Republicans were obviously going to lose the election, the Democrats would've found it unfair if lame duck Bush got to appoint someone.


See, this is why I hate every single Republican. Just living in an alternate reality.

Garland is completely milquetoast. my lord.

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Mon Jun 27, 2022 3:22 pm
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Post Re: The Biden era: The Establishment Strikes Back
Chippy wrote:
See, this is why I hate every single Republican. Just living in an alternate reality.


When you're living in upside down world, it's easy for the people living right side up to look upside down

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Post Re: The Biden era: The Establishment Strikes Back
Clearly.

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shut the fuck up zwackerm, you're out of your fucking element

trixster wrote:
chippy is correct

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Mon Jun 27, 2022 3:27 pm
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Post Re: The Biden era: The Establishment Strikes Back
Chippy wrote:
Clearly.


Your frame of reference is so shifted so far left that you think people slightly to the right of AOC are moderates

In my view the people in the middle are ones like Mitt Romney, Tulsi Gabbard, Joe Manchin, Krysten Sinema, John Roberts, etc. Those are the ones where roughly half the people in congress are to the left of them and half are to the right.

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Post Re: The Biden era: The Establishment Strikes Back
Shack wrote:
You could also argue that Obama could have negotiated with McConnell for someone halfway in between Garland and Gorsuch in terms of their views. McConnell would have been motivated to hedge because of the high chance in early 2016 that the Republicans were going to lose to Hillary hence getting someone with roughly Roberts views while he can possibly would've been in his interest compared to losing and having Garland. But Obama probably didn't want to compromise with a Roberts type judge because he assumed Hillary was going to beat Trump, and who can blame him.


It's not a President's job to negotiate over who he picks for the Supreme Court. It's their job to nominate someone to fill an empty seat. And it's the Senate's duty to confirm or reject said nominee. Do they *have* to? No, but you're holding up the process and obstructing the duties of another branch of government. If Garland was so bad, they could have voted against him.

The Democrats (Executive Branch) really let this go, like they seem to always do now, back in 2016. And today, or since Biden took office, they should have passed legislation to prevent an abuse of power from happening again.

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“There are three things all wise men fear: the sea in storm, a night with no moon, and the anger of a gentle man.”
“You have to pretend you get an endgame. You have to carry on like you will; otherwise, you can't carry on at all.”
"Paper is dead without words / Ink idle without a poem / All the world dead without stories."


Mon Jun 27, 2022 4:43 pm
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Post Re: The Biden era: The Establishment Strikes Back
Flava'd vs The World wrote:
zwackerm wrote:
Corpse wrote:
zwackerm wrote:
Mitch McConnell is a hero for keeping judicial activist Merrick Garland off the supreme court. He should have been honest and said that was the real reason for keeping him off, but it's good that he kept him off nonetheless.


Disrupting a President of his Constitutional duty? Tainting the legitimacy of the Senate and the Supreme Court?

At least you're being honest and saying it's to push one ideological belief as right over another. But any respect is basically gone for you; you see things through a "this way or that way" lens of black and white.


The senate is not obligated to confirm incompetent judges. If Obama had nominated someone who would actually interpret the constitution rather than insert whatever ideological desires the Democrat president had, there's a strong chance they would have been confirmed.
:funny: :funny: :funny: :funny: This is the most absurd thing I've read amongst an ocean of absurdity these last few days. Barack Obama could have nominated Ronald Reagan and it would have been shut down once McConnell figured out that he could do it and face absolutely zero consequences since republican voters place zero value on moral integrity.

This is why democracy is dying. Delusional kookers will justify any obstruction of justice so long as fits their baseless fantasies.


Thanks for quoting him (sort of). When I see his name now I just picture some guy riding God's dick while begging for forgiveness the entire time, and that's not a sight I want to see, so he's blocked (will see how it goes, helps outside of this forum at least).

I wouldn't have seen what he said otherwise, which is worth replying to in this case.

McConnell has literally said he will NOT consider any nominee. Any nominee. There was no chance he'd considered anyone then, and there's no chance he'd consider any nominee in the future. He has literally said this, so stop trying to argue McConnell is somehow being reasonable here by not considering "incompetent" judges that most in the Senate aren't even qualified to determine.

And the argument that "SCOTUS didn't ban abortion! They just sent it back to the States!" Oh? You have big names in the GOP already saying now that this is done, it's their goal to get it banned in EVERY State. You have House members saying they'll draft legislation for a nationwide ban. It wasn't about sending it back to the States. FFS.

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“Gods are great ... but the heart is greater. For it is from our hearts they come, and to our hearts they shall return.”
“We were like gods at the dawning of the world, & our joy was so bright we could see nothing else but the other.”
“There are three things all wise men fear: the sea in storm, a night with no moon, and the anger of a gentle man.”
“You have to pretend you get an endgame. You have to carry on like you will; otherwise, you can't carry on at all.”
"Paper is dead without words / Ink idle without a poem / All the world dead without stories."


Mon Jun 27, 2022 5:06 pm
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Post Re: The Biden era: The Establishment Strikes Back
Obviously some of them would, but it would be minimum 2.5 years before they can do anything, and would require big 2024 sweep or something

Some Republican governors like DeSantis and Youngkin are targeting 15 week ban

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Mon Jun 27, 2022 5:24 pm
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Post Re: The Biden era: The Establishment Strikes Back
Corpse wrote:
Shack wrote:
You could also argue that Obama could have negotiated with McConnell for someone halfway in between Garland and Gorsuch in terms of their views. McConnell would have been motivated to hedge because of the high chance in early 2016 that the Republicans were going to lose to Hillary hence getting someone with roughly Roberts views while he can possibly would've been in his interest compared to losing and having Garland. But Obama probably didn't want to compromise with a Roberts type judge because he assumed Hillary was going to beat Trump, and who can blame him.


It's not a President's job to negotiate over who he picks for the Supreme Court. It's their job to nominate someone to fill an empty seat. And it's the Senate's duty to confirm or reject said nominee. Do they *have* to? No, but you're holding up the process and obstructing the duties of another branch of government. If Garland was so bad, they could have voted against him.

The Democrats (Executive Branch) really let this go, like they seem to always do now, back in 2016. And today, or since Biden took office, they should have passed legislation to prevent an abuse of power from happening again.


Should McConnell be taken at face value? After all, he went against it for the Barrett nomination. I think if Obama nominated Gorsuch he would have said yes instead of playing the lame duck card.

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Mon Jun 27, 2022 8:20 pm
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Post Re: The Biden era: The Establishment Strikes Back
Thing is, he didn’t even put it up to a vote. Just ignored it and moved on.

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Mon Jun 27, 2022 9:18 pm
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Post Re: The Biden era: The Establishment Strikes Back
Corpse wrote:
Flava'd vs The World wrote:
zwackerm wrote:
Corpse wrote:
zwackerm wrote:
Mitch McConnell is a hero for keeping judicial activist Merrick Garland off the supreme court. He should have been honest and said that was the real reason for keeping him off, but it's good that he kept him off nonetheless.


Disrupting a President of his Constitutional duty? Tainting the legitimacy of the Senate and the Supreme Court?

At least you're being honest and saying it's to push one ideological belief as right over another. But any respect is basically gone for you; you see things through a "this way or that way" lens of black and white.


The senate is not obligated to confirm incompetent judges. If Obama had nominated someone who would actually interpret the constitution rather than insert whatever ideological desires the Democrat president had, there's a strong chance they would have been confirmed.
:funny: :funny: :funny: :funny: This is the most absurd thing I've read amongst an ocean of absurdity these last few days. Barack Obama could have nominated Ronald Reagan and it would have been shut down once McConnell figured out that he could do it and face absolutely zero consequences since republican voters place zero value on moral integrity.

This is why democracy is dying. Delusional kookers will justify any obstruction of justice so long as fits their baseless fantasies.


Thanks for quoting him (sort of). When I see his name now I just picture some guy riding God's dick while begging for forgiveness the entire time, and that's not a sight I want to see, so he's blocked (will see how it goes, helps outside of this forum at least).

I wouldn't have seen what he said otherwise, which is worth replying to in this case.

McConnell has literally said he will NOT consider any nominee. Any nominee. There was no chance he'd considered anyone then, and there's no chance he'd consider any nominee in the future. He has literally said this, so stop trying to argue McConnell is somehow being reasonable here by not considering "incompetent" judges that most in the Senate aren't even qualified to determine.

And the argument that "SCOTUS didn't ban abortion! They just sent it back to the States!" Oh? You have big names in the GOP already saying now that this is done, it's their goal to get it banned in EVERY State. You have House members saying they'll draft legislation for a nationwide ban. It wasn't about sending it back to the States. FFS.


Yeah, Republicans would love a nationwide abortion ban. But the only way that would happen in less than a century from now would be if we could elect 60 pro life senators and the legislation was not struck down by the supreme court at the time.


Mon Jun 27, 2022 10:25 pm
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Post Re: The Biden era: The Establishment Strikes Back
You could make an amendment. It is the only way to get around the Supreme Court

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Mon Jun 27, 2022 11:38 pm
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Post Re: The Biden era: The Establishment Strikes Back
Every red and purple state would need to get on board and that is not happening anytime soon, if ever.


Tue Jun 28, 2022 8:20 am
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Post Re: The Biden era: The Establishment Strikes Back
No, you only need 38 states, which isn’t impossible when it comes to something as unpopular as this, but you’re right, it won’t happen anytime soon, especially with how weak the Democrats are

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