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Excel
Superfreak
Joined: Sat Aug 20, 2005 12:54 am
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 Re: The Curious Case Of Florida And Michigan good...good...polls have them tied
_________________Ari Emmanuel wrote: I'd rather marry lindsay Lohan than represent Mel Gibson.
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| Fri Mar 14, 2008 4:14 pm |
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Ripper
2.71828183
Joined: Mon Oct 11, 2004 9:16 pm
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Location: please delete me
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Re: The Curious Case Of Florida And Michigan Bah, I'm with Dean on this, you shouldn't get break the rules, and then get your state's primary to count even more after.
Basically, this you should just encourage every state to do this next time.
As dolce has pointed out, FLA is basically lost for the Dems, this revote is not gonna change that.
They made a decision, stick to it, or they shouldn't have penalized the states in the first place.
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| Fri Mar 14, 2008 4:43 pm |
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redspear
Indiana Jones IV
Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2005 12:08 am
Posts: 1879
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Re: The Curious Case Of Florida And Michigan Groucho wrote: My comment was in response to the one that said, basically, who cares if Obama has the most delegates and votes -- we should only look to the "big states" and who won those. I wasn't specifically addressing Florida and Michigan.
And since you did try to put words in my mouth in another thread, I just said "Oh great, he's doing it again." Glad to see that this one was just a misunderstanding.
Hillary's people don't seem to realize how much they are insulting the other 40 states. Whenever Obama wins, she says "Oh, it's just some small, minor state, who cares what they think?" Well, they get to vote too, you know. That's what I was objecting to.
I will certainly vote for Hillary, but I'm not sure "proud" would be the word. (Well, I would be proud for our country for finally electing a woman President... ) I voted for Kerry and Gore and Dukakis, too, but in each case, I didn't think they were the greatest choice we had (although they were obviously better than the Republican who eventually won). I'd like, for once, to have my first choice win. I liked Gore a lot. Kerry was a lousy choice and it was hte onoly the second time I voted Democrat but only because it was an anti bush vote. TBH I was voting Kerry hoping he would win and the excitement would cause him to have a heart attack and Edwards would be president. Not that Kerry would have been a horrible president mind you. This will be the second time I vote for a democrat where I am actiually voting for the candidate and it will be either Obama or Hillary though I hope it will be Hillary. BTW I voted third Party in 92 and 96. What you didn't vote for Mondale(I am ashamed) LOL JK.
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Cromulent!
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| Fri Mar 14, 2008 6:06 pm |
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Anita Hussein Briem
Yes we can call dibs on the mountain guide
Joined: Tue Apr 19, 2005 5:47 pm
Posts: 3290
Location: Houston
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Re: The Curious Case Of Florida And Michigan They should listen to Bill Nelson. Seat half of the Florida delegation and split Michigan 50-50. That is the best Obama can expect from Florida in an actual redo, and the best Clinton can expect out of Michigan.
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(hitokiri battousai)
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| Sat Mar 15, 2008 12:53 pm |
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Eagle
Site Owner
Joined: Wed Sep 15, 2004 1:09 pm
Posts: 14631
Location: Pittsburgh
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Re: The Curious Case Of Florida And Michigan Well Florida has officially said it won't be holding a second primary. So Hillary keeps her big lead there. And their is an interesting lawsuit from all this: http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/03/17/ ... index.html_________________
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| Mon Mar 17, 2008 9:18 pm |
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Groucho
Extraordinary
Joined: Thu Oct 21, 2004 9:30 pm
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Location: Stroudsburg, PA
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Re: The Curious Case Of Florida And Michigan Of course, how appropriate. It all boils down to a lawsuit in Florida over whether votes are to be counted. _________________Buy my books! http://michaelaventrella.com
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| Mon Mar 17, 2008 9:21 pm |
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Excel
Superfreak
Joined: Sat Aug 20, 2005 12:54 am
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Re: The Curious Case Of Florida And Michigan eagle, deans made VERY clear the elecetion in fla n michigan that occured WONT COUTN, so if theres no revote, they wont count.
_________________Ari Emmanuel wrote: I'd rather marry lindsay Lohan than represent Mel Gibson.
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| Tue Mar 18, 2008 1:15 am |
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Corpse
Don't Dream It, Be It
Joined: Wed Aug 02, 2006 12:45 pm
Posts: 37152
Location: The Graveyard
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Re: The Curious Case Of Florida And Michigan Magnus wrote: This just gives more reason NOT to count the vote. No way you can count these votes to be legit. Even Hilary knows that.
It is a bit undemocratic to not count the votes (even though FL broke the rules). But it's even more undemocratic to count them and NOT have a revote, when the first vote was hardly fair at all.
MI is another story though. Only Hillary's name was on the ballot. Obama and Edwards pulled their names, so honoring the results of MI wouldn't be fair at all. There really needs to be another primay in MI._________________Japan Box Office “Gods are great ... but the heart is greater. For it is from our hearts they come, and to our hearts they shall return.”
“We were like gods at the dawning of the world, & our joy was so bright we could see nothing else but the other.”
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| Tue Mar 18, 2008 1:16 am |
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Excel
Superfreak
Joined: Sat Aug 20, 2005 12:54 am
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Re: The Curious Case Of Florida And Michigan something will be done in michigan, but at this point fla is done, and with it so is hillary.
_________________Ari Emmanuel wrote: I'd rather marry lindsay Lohan than represent Mel Gibson.
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| Tue Mar 18, 2008 1:20 am |
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Eagle
Site Owner
Joined: Wed Sep 15, 2004 1:09 pm
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Location: Pittsburgh
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Re: The Curious Case Of Florida And Michigan Excel,
Dean has no say. It goes to the Credentials Committee which will decide to either seat the delegates, seat half the delegates with current results (what I think will happen), or seat none of the delegates.
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| Tue Mar 18, 2008 3:26 pm |
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Anita Hussein Briem
Yes we can call dibs on the mountain guide
Joined: Tue Apr 19, 2005 5:47 pm
Posts: 3290
Location: Houston
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Re: The Curious Case Of Florida And Michigan http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpoints ... pporte.phpIn summary, Clinton campaign hits up George Soros for money to fund a Michigan revote. George Soros: Hell no.
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(hitokiri battousai)
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| Tue Mar 18, 2008 4:51 pm |
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Groucho
Extraordinary
Joined: Thu Oct 21, 2004 9:30 pm
Posts: 12096
Location: Stroudsburg, PA
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Re: The Curious Case Of Florida And Michigan Angela Merkel wrote: http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/03/exclusive_top_hillary_supporte.php
In summary, Clinton campaign hits up George Soros for money to fund a Michigan revote.
George Soros: Hell no.   I hope they just decide to split the delegates 50 50 and let them come to the convention. No, actually, I hope Hillary gives up for the good of the party. _________________Buy my books! http://michaelaventrella.com
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| Tue Mar 18, 2008 8:26 pm |
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Anita Hussein Briem
Yes we can call dibs on the mountain guide
Joined: Tue Apr 19, 2005 5:47 pm
Posts: 3290
Location: Houston
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Re: The Curious Case Of Florida And Michigan I actually wouldn't mind the Florida delegates being seated. After all, Hillary got 50% vs Obama/Edwards at 47%. It can't be more than a 15 delegate loss for Obama in the end, if the Iowa convention is any precedent.
Michigan is a total mess. Only people like Saddam Hussein hold yes/no elections; trying to seat the Michigan delegates reflected very poorly upon Clinton.
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(hitokiri battousai)
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| Tue Mar 18, 2008 8:33 pm |
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redspear
Indiana Jones IV
Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2005 12:08 am
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Re: The Curious Case Of Florida And Michigan Angela Merkel wrote: I actually wouldn't mind the Florida delegates being seated. After all, Hillary got 50% vs Obama/Edwards at 47%. It can't be more than a 15 delegate loss for Obama in the end, if the Iowa convention is any precedent.
Michigan is a total mess. Only people like Saddam Hussein hold yes/no elections; trying to seat the Michigan delegates reflected very poorly upon Clinton. I agree but I don't think it should have to do with any number of delegates that went for one candidate or the other. It comes down to all the names on the ballot+ no offical campaign by any candidate..Obama and Clinton both had supporters campaigning for them but no offical campaign. It is as fair as Florida will get which sucks. Michigan needs a revote(since candidates are missing) or not count at all since they didn't really vote...Although Obama did have a grass roots uncommited campaign run by supporters just like edwards or Clinton...it really isn't the same since there was no way to count the vote and political poison for Clinton to take the delegates as is. Michigan really needs a revote and I would say that regardless of the outcome of the first vote. I think not counting Florida at all is undemocratic however cutting the delegates in half is a fair compromise..It still gets them a say. BTW what would happen if clinton goes into the convention with the higher popular vote but the lower delegate count?
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| Wed Mar 19, 2008 12:54 am |
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Anita Hussein Briem
Yes we can call dibs on the mountain guide
Joined: Tue Apr 19, 2005 5:47 pm
Posts: 3290
Location: Houston
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Re: The Curious Case Of Florida And Michigan The problem with assuming Florida as fair is that Clinton has a lot of support from default voters. If you notice carefully, every state Obama campaigns in sees significant improvement in his numbers, and that he tends to perform poorly among rural counties without campaign organization. In other words, without agitation, the contest is not "fair", so to speak, but tilted heavily towards Clinton.
Michigan is a horrible mess especially since Democrats and independents that voted in the Republican primary cannot vote again.
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(hitokiri battousai)
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| Wed Mar 19, 2008 1:22 am |
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