DeSantis is in many ways worse than Trump. I used to like him during the Pandemic era for his willingness unlike Rick Scott to work with Democrats for the betterment of Floridians and he handled the hurricanes here very well, but his transformation into a culture war warlord turned me off something strong to him. Glad he was embarrassed after his war with Disney

DeSantis had a pretty good resume as governor showing that he follows through on his rhetoric but didn't quite have it as a talker, the opposite of Vivek who said all the right things but didn't have the track record showing he's not just saying what he needs to get elected, ultimately there needed to be someone who combined both to beat Trump.

Oh well. Maybe I’ll be excited to vote for someone in the 2028 primary.

Guess I’m voting for Haley in the PA primary if she doesn’t drop out. Don’t like her but think she has a better chance to win than Trump in the general

Why would there be a primary in 2028 if the Trumps are already in power? You aren't making any sense.

For real. If Trump wins, it should be expected he and his team actively seek ways for him to stay in power past 2028. If he's still alive. The man is looking pretty rough in recent weeks/months.

And I'm seeing a lot of MAGA Republicans calling Nikki Haley a liar, cheater, this week. Umm... I don't care for her either, but c'mon. Even if any number of things said about her is true, it's a fraction of what Trump has said or done. I know most in the MAGA dimension live in delusion land, but how can you attack someone for lying of all things?

Yeah it’s impossible for Trump to stay in power post 2028 without a constitutional amendment.

Think about it. Trump never lost and therefore is still the president so he's already defying the 22nd amendment. What are people gonna do if he runs for a fourth term? Not vote for him?

True, but Trump and most of his supporters have shown they care very little about such things. Look what happened on January 6th. I think it can be a little overblown by some, but at the same time if there had been more of a plan and organization behind it by Trump, if he had ordered federal law enforcement to assist with it, and if Pence had been a diehard supporter (if enough in Congress had been), what then? What could the constitution had done? There is an amendment to help prevent such things, but if things progress past that point, well...

It can come across as scare-tactics, fear-mongering when the left talks about January 6th, but there was a potential real threat behind that chaos.

And now that Trump has seen that despite that, despite all his other troubles, he isn't going to lose any support, rather his legal issues has strengthened his support with the far-right, it wouldn't be shocking if he actively works together with law enforcement, lawmakers, and of course his supporters, to make an effective effort to, well, destroy democracy (or at least elections).

It feels very "fantasy", but there's been enough to make a legit try at doing it. And when a person with an ego like Trump sees he's lost little/no support among his supporters, when they see half of Congress/the law rally behind him despite criticisms, when they see others ready to fight for him no matter the alternative, it's always been a powerful and potentially dangerous thing historically. A solid third of the country want to eliminate government already. The "impossible" is tossed aside.

You can hate Biden. You can hate Democratic policies. But those are largely temporary things. And anyone with a respect and caring for what America is and how it works should consider the risk of Trump being elected again. Vote Republican up and down the ticket. Give Biden the lamest duck second term ever. Just don't vote for Trump at the top.

For people that think J6 is overblown/milked, Trump potentially being put in jail like politicians who challenge Putin or South American dictators is a more dangerous sign of authoritarianism than his speech claiming the election is rigged

I think the more extreme a side goes politically the more danger there is of authoritarianism because they decide winning and spreading their ideology is more important than the right to vote, people are not allowed to vote "for their own good", neither commies or nazis like democracy that much. There is disagreement on which is the more extreme between the current left/right currently, there are libs out there who don't think woke is a real thing, for me as someone who does and thinks the cultish psychological energy is on the far left right now, they're the ones I don't trust to keep valuing free voting and untainted elections over the left always winning. For people who don't think we're living in a psychological moment where far left activism seems abnormally aggressive/manipulative/prevalent/etc. and that the world is just having business as usual right now, or they think it's not but the abnormality psychologically on the right wing side, I understand why it's hard to accept that.

Remove what people think, and what should happen if Trump is convicted by a court of law? Should he not face the legal consequences of his actions, even if that would include jail time? If nothing were to happen, what stops others from breaking the law? Everyone is held accountable by the law or nobody is. Period.

I wouldn't call Trump a dictator before the fact, but when he talks like one, and when his supporters say they want to be in a dictatorship in interviews, it's not a farfetched possibility Trump would aim to be one given he regularly praises them and would have the support behind him to do it. And when people with extreme egotism like Trump have their ideas supported like this, they begin to think they're this chosen one sent to save humanity.

I don't care how much someone hates the Democratic party or what the left-wing of it may represent to them, getting behind a man who expresses admiration of dictators and has been given an invitation to become one himself by supporters isn't the way to go. It's not Trump or nothing.

And we can debate which side of the political spectrum poses a bigger risk, but the truth is that any extreme regardless of side can be dangerous and shouldn't be applauded or given support.

DeSantis was the true conservative, Trump is something far more dangerous not because of his politics which outside of immigration are actually fairly moderate, it’s the danger he poses in pushing this country towards ending the rule of law and allowing politicians to openly break these laws that keep powers in check right in front of us.

DeSantis was the true conservative, Trump is something far more dangerous not because of his politics which outside of immigration are actually fairly moderate, it’s the danger he poses in pushing this country towards ending the rule of law and allowing politicians to openly break these laws that keep powers in check right in front of us.

Shack do you really believe liberals would put up with Joe Biden throwing a hissy fit that including overthrowing out democracy if he loses? Cause there's no fucking way we would. Instead, we would take turns kicking him in the nuts until he was dead. That's the most important difference between the parties right now. Cause conservatives have proven without a shadow of a doubt that they have no problem with their leaders throwing hissy fits that include overthrowing the government.

I don't see Trump exhausting his options to challenge an election which is the entire purpose of the the whole 2.5 month multi step process in between the November and late January inauguration, including a last hail mary attempt of testing out electoral college act language, as trying to overthrow the government. He thinks he won the election so that would make it the pro-democracy side to try to preserve the real winner.

As for J6 the left called a riot an Insurrection for the same reason the right is currently calling illegal immigrants an Invasion. It's a more loaded/manipulative/catchy word and both words have pragmatic uses in the constitution like trying to ban Trump or Greg Abbott using it to declare Texas has power to control border.

Except he was told he lost by everyone and still tried to defraud the entire election with fake electors and pushed members of his own cabinet and administration to go along with his scheme against their will

Shack is a smart person who will one day be fully aware of how 'in denial' he has been.

Mark Meadows, Mike Pence, Pat Cillophone, and all of the other attorneys & actors who have come forward post 1/6 and testified that Trump has been completely informed that he lost the election & proceeded to openly lie about it anyway are not all in cahoots together to spite Trump. They are telling the truth.

The Federal investigators, state governments & court systems of Georgia, Arizona, Pennsylvania, Michigan, Wisconsin, and co who have said there was no evidence the election was "rigged" or that the wrong outcome was presented are not all in cahoots together to spite Trump. They are telling the truth.

John Kelly, Bill Barr, Mike Pence, Chris Christie, and every other former Trump admin official who has said that Trump was a historically bad President who should never touch office again are not making things up for fun. They are telling the truth.

Donald Trump was a horrific President by many legitimate measures who lost a legitimate election. Those are not opinions, they are simple facts, and it is really strange and, at this point, sad to see that some people have still not come to peace with this.

Trump's legal problem is that he did not accept or respect legitimate the findings of the bolded efforts. In America, you pretty much have to respect the findings of the court system, and if you don't, it usually lands in legal trouble, which is precisely the route DT chose to take.

When his personal "thinking he won the election" takes precedent to the actual findings of the legal efforts and is then put into action using the current legal authority that Trump...yes that is 100% illegal, many of the attorneys working with him at the time knew that it was and told him so, and Trump proceeded anyway.

This isn't rocket science. "From his POV he is doing the right thing and it isn't illegal" doesn't matter. The POV of the Court system is what he has to follow. You're saying "Charles Manson thought the person deserved to die, so by telling his followers to kill them, he was going the right thing from his perspective", and you're aware that doesn't jack shit when the court respond "Well, we disagree, and its our POV that matters, not yours".

It is not hyperbole, rather obvious observation, to note that Trump is a selfish person who uses people and pushes the boundaries was far he can he until the pushback on him. He went way too far this time.

Stating the very obvious Trump's performance in New Hampshire is obviously a bad sign for him. Pretty much every available election reading signals a clear reduction in support for Trump compared to 2020. There are just a shitload of right leaning "never Trumpers" out now, far more than there are left leaning "Never Biden" people. His post election behavior is almost certainly a more powerful factor than anything Biden has done or hasn't done. Many of them will probably come around and vote for him over Biden, but it will be a fraction of what it was in 2020. The signs show swing moderates in swing states leaning heavily towards giving Biden a 2nd term before they give Trump a 2nd term in 2028.

Looking at the states, Biden won Michigan by 150,000 votes and Pennsylvania by 81,000. Would put odds that Trump flips either of those very low. Winning just 1 of Wisconsin (Biden by 20,000), Arizona (11,000), or Georgia (12,000) puts Biden back in the White House. Given the senate race performances in Arizona and Georgia, those seem to be trending more blue, not less. Wisconsin is likely closer to neutral.

Those Trump losses were all before his post-election drama of course, a dynamic that favors Biden over Trump, as well before the Roe v Wade overturn. Should the economy remain solid over the next 9 months, Biden is obviously in the stronger position of the 2.

Why do you think the Vice President reading votes on J6 was an important procedural date in the first place instead of just ceremonial (which it now is after they changed the rules in response to this)? Because after 1876 when they had "both sides think their electors should count" scenario their plan was to give the vice president more power to decide which electors to count. In the case of a stolen election, the vice president rejecting the results and letting the houses decide potentially could avoid the wrong side stealing it. As I said the entire process between November and late January can be seen as preparing for settling contested elections like this or Bush/Gore, or saving the US from stolen ones, and it would be a mistake to eliminate it and start treating it as illegal to claim it was rigged, because then if someone really did steal it they would be no way to stop them. When a party in the US makes it illegal for someone who lost an election to call it rigged that's the party people should be worried about. The Republicans started talking about electoral act move on Jan 6 in middle of December as last hail mary attempt to challenge the election, the Supreme Court ultimately would have decided if Pence went through with it. It doesn't seem that unreasonable or a crime.

Absolutely not. You are talking as if this "winner take all". Did you see Trump contesting any states he won? One of the large benefits of the state system is that the state's independent court systems and governments are the ones certifying the results, not the Vice President.

For someone to "steal" an election to the extent where the final outcome is changed, many of the individual state courts and governments would have to be in on the game. Pretty sure you don't have a single piece of evidence suggesting this...



Bush/Gore was about 1 state, Florida, that was well within the recount margin. Bush v. Gore had the additional issue of voters complaining, on election day, of a confusing ballot causing them to screw up their vote. That is a ridiculous comparison to bring up.



From this moment forward, please stop writing as the presidential election is 1 large election ala "steal it". American Presidential election is the sum of 50 individual elections. You are not talking about someone stealing 1 election, you're talking about stealing half a dozen more, which is preposterous.

From here on it, you need to say "for them steal 6 or more state elections".



You need to think through your understanding of the American legal process. For anything election related item to reach the Supreme Court, it would be on a state by state basis beginning in the state court system.

Also - no party in the US made it illegal to say that an election as rigged. In 2020, a number of Republican run state governments and court systems, stuffed with judges picked by Trump and who voted for Trump, ruled there was no remotely legitimate evidence of voter fraud to Biden's benefit in those states.

On a simple, kindergarten level, it is not illegal for Trump to lie about the election. He is legally allowed to make the statement "I think I won the election".

On the contrary, though - numerous laws (not a "political party") do, in fact, make it illegal for an individual holding state or federal office to use the power associated with that officeto keep them in office, which is a fundamentally different thing than simply saying "I think I won". Examples of crossing said legal line include things like:

- developing and trying to execute a plan involving non-state approved electors certifying an election result. This is fraud.
- pressuring a state Sec. of State to "find" the amount of votes a candidate lost by despite ample evidence the votes don't exist. This is trying coerce fraud.
-encouraging supporters to disrupt the certification of the election & withdrawing from responsibilities to intervene when said disruption occurs. This is...many bad things.

To be blunt, you are dramatically oversimplifying and cherry picking things to fit a narrative which is obviously factually absurd.

In all seriousness, how hard is it to just say "I got this one wrong"?

Unless you have concrete reasons to say "These 10 individual state governments and court systems are demonstrably corrupt in Biden's favor based on X, Y, Z and the Supreme Court needed to hear the cases on all 10 states as a result" - which is what an actual argument about a "rigged election" would look - just say you have gotten it wrong and move on.

You're killing your brain cells with this shit.

If Supreme Court had overturned the election then Republicans electors would've voted for him. This is all the supposed "fake electors scheme" is.

The whole phone call thing is a speech crime that depends on interpreting the word find in the worst possible way, if you take the Trump defending side it's just a poorly chosen word.

Trump said in his speech to march peacefully, he sent out a tweet telling people to be peaceful and then after capital was entered he sent out a video on twitter (quickly censored) telling people to go home.





Ultimately the the anti-Trump people have been hysterically searching for any, ANY possible to put him in jail for the last 7 years. None of this stuff, Mar a Lago boxes, etc. are very good reasons, but they'll take what they can get and then try to justify it.

No, we have seen people who have done less already in jail. Ignore Trump as a political figure, it is important to do so when looking at the full story and you can see he has a long history of pushing what he can legally do for years and has relied on creative lawyering to get him to avoid being legally held accountable his entire adult life. This is nothing new for him, just that now he is not going up against disgruntled workers, black tenants, and gullible students; he is going up against the United States Federal Government

So in terms of house races. Democrats are guaranteed essentially 2 pickups in Louisiana and Alabama and Republicans 3 pickups in North Carolina. And they should get the Alaska district as long as Palin doesn’t run again.

We’ll see what other states get redistricted.

Not feeling a huge change one way or the other from the current makeup. Expecting the majority will remain at around 5-6 seats for whichever party wins the house.

Sounds about right. I think the Senate is the GOP’s to lose, but they seem to picking bad general candidates again. The White House meanwhile should have been a shoo-in for the GOP, but instead they pick the one guy who can lose. They can’t help themselves