Register  |  Sign In
View unanswered posts | View active topics It is currently Fri Mar 29, 2024 6:41 am



Reply to topic  [ 19 posts ] 
 National Defense Authorization Act 
Author Message
Killing With Kindness
User avatar

Joined: Mon Oct 11, 2004 8:57 pm
Posts: 25020
Location: Anchorage,Alaska
Post National Defense Authorization Act
http://www.mercurynews.com/opinion/ci_19413004

Quote:
Section 1031, would let the military lock up both Americans and noncitizens in the 50 states. There would be no charges, no trial, no proof beyond a reasonable doubt. All that would be required would be suspicion.


Thoughts?

_________________
The Force Awakens

Image


Thu Dec 01, 2011 5:01 pm
Profile WWW
Wall-E
User avatar

Joined: Thu Feb 17, 2005 5:25 pm
Posts: 855
Post Re: National Defense Authorization Act
Does anyone remember the movie with John Agar, "The Brain From Planet Arous"?

I think Joe McCarthy, Richard Daley, Ronald Reagan and Richard Nixon ain't dead.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0050210/plotsummary

EDIT: John McCain co-authored this P.o.S. Must have been watching his P.O.W. movies again...


Thu Dec 01, 2011 6:08 pm
Profile WWW
A very honest-hearted fellow
User avatar

Joined: Mon Oct 11, 2004 8:02 pm
Posts: 4767
Post Re: National Defense Authorization Act
I read that this was actually requested by the Obama Administration. My thought is that it is abominable. If captured outside the United States and on a battlefield, fine, lock them away without any habeas corpus rights for the remainder of hostilities and preferably in some secret prison in a friendly dictators country.


Thu Dec 01, 2011 11:20 pm
Profile WWW
Powered By Hate
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 8:55 pm
Posts: 7578
Location: Torrington, CT
Post Re: National Defense Authorization Act
Horrible.

_________________
It's my lucky crack pipe.


Sat Dec 03, 2011 12:46 am
Profile
007
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2005 11:43 pm
Posts: 10986
Location: Wouldn't you like to know
Post Re: National Defense Authorization Act
Caius wrote:
I read that this was actually requested by the Obama Administration. My thought is that it is abominable. If captured outside the United States and on a battlefield, fine, lock them away without any habeas corpus rights for the remainder of hostilities and preferably in some secret prison in a friendly dictators country.


Except Obama plans to veto the bill:

http://www.allvoices.com/contributed-ne ... ns-of-veto

_________________
Image


Sat Dec 03, 2011 6:26 pm
Profile
Extraordinary
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 11, 2005 9:51 pm
Posts: 11637
Post Re: National Defense Authorization Act
Darth Indiana Bond wrote:
Caius wrote:
I read that this was actually requested by the Obama Administration. My thought is that it is abominable. If captured outside the United States and on a battlefield, fine, lock them away without any habeas corpus rights for the remainder of hostilities and preferably in some secret prison in a friendly dictators country.


Except Obama plans to veto the bill:

http://www.allvoices.com/contributed-ne ... ns-of-veto



Yeah I was going to say that too. I thought he was against this bill.


Sat Dec 03, 2011 8:52 pm
Profile WWW
A very honest-hearted fellow
User avatar

Joined: Mon Oct 11, 2004 8:02 pm
Posts: 4767
Post Re: National Defense Authorization Act
Jedi Master Carr wrote:
Darth Indiana Bond wrote:
Caius wrote:
I read that this was actually requested by the Obama Administration. My thought is that it is abominable. If captured outside the United States and on a battlefield, fine, lock them away without any habeas corpus rights for the remainder of hostilities and preferably in some secret prison in a friendly dictators country.


Except Obama plans to veto the bill:

http://www.allvoices.com/contributed-ne ... ns-of-veto



Yeah I was going to say that too. I thought he was against this bill.


What relevance is that to my statement? My understanding is the Administration's veto threat concerned Guantanamo type issues.

http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/SenateSession4951

Go to the 4:43 mark and you can hear Democratic Senator Carl Levin on the floor of the Senate say just what I said. That the Obama administration pushed for the removal of the language which would have exempted U.S. Citizens from such indefinite detention.


Tue Dec 06, 2011 1:46 am
Profile WWW
Extraordinary
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 11, 2005 7:13 pm
Posts: 11015
Location: Warren Theatre Oklahoma
Post Re: National Defense Authorization Act
BJ wrote:
http://www.mercurynews.com/opinion/ci_19413004

Quote:
Section 1031, would let the military lock up both Americans and noncitizens in the 50 states. There would be no charges, no trial, no proof beyond a reasonable doubt. All that would be required would be suspicion.


Thoughts?


Well...

We have to defeat the terrorists you know. This is the only way we can do it. This is the only way we can win.


Tue Dec 06, 2011 4:02 pm
Profile
loyalfromlondon
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 6:31 pm
Posts: 19697
Location: ville-marie
Post Re: National Defense Authorization Act
Throwing away habeas corpus and locking up American citizens without charges, trial, or proof is not how you win. It's how the terrorists win.

_________________
Magic Mike wrote:
zwackerm wrote:
If John Wick 2 even makes 30 million I will eat 1,000 shoes.


Same.


Algren wrote:
I don't think. I predict. ;)


Tue Dec 06, 2011 5:30 pm
Profile
007
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2005 11:43 pm
Posts: 10986
Location: Wouldn't you like to know
Post Re: National Defense Authorization Act
Caius wrote:
Jedi Master Carr wrote:
Darth Indiana Bond wrote:
Caius wrote:
I read that this was actually requested by the Obama Administration. My thought is that it is abominable. If captured outside the United States and on a battlefield, fine, lock them away without any habeas corpus rights for the remainder of hostilities and preferably in some secret prison in a friendly dictators country.


Except Obama plans to veto the bill:

http://www.allvoices.com/contributed-ne ... ns-of-veto



Yeah I was going to say that too. I thought he was against this bill.


What relevance is that to my statement? My understanding is the Administration's veto threat concerned Guantanamo type issues.

http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/SenateSession4951

Go to the 4:43 mark and you can hear Democratic Senator Carl Levin on the floor of the Senate say just what I said. That the Obama administration pushed for the removal of the language which would have exempted U.S. Citizens from such indefinite detention.


What the hell are you talking about? I think that's what you want him to say more than what he actually stated. It would seem as though the president does have some desire to get something like this passed, but the senators drones on about how the bill is not developed enough, and later on states how the bill as it is could override 200 years of legal work, and how the bill as it currently exists could have horrible side effects.

_________________
Image


Tue Dec 06, 2011 7:10 pm
Profile
Forum General
User avatar

Joined: Wed May 10, 2006 3:53 pm
Posts: 8636
Location: Toronto, Canada
Post Re: National Defense Authorization Act
Frankly the govt has been able to able to lock up people and hold them for a long time anyways (look at what happened after 9/11) and can simply suspend habeas corpus in a time of war.

Also, Obama could veto it but he will use drones to kill any threat (own citizen) it appears and imo I think there is nothing wrong with that.

_________________
The Dark Prince

Image


Wed Dec 07, 2011 12:41 am
Profile WWW
007
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2005 11:43 pm
Posts: 10986
Location: Wouldn't you like to know
Post Re: National Defense Authorization Act
Darth Indiana Bond wrote:
Caius wrote:
Jedi Master Carr wrote:
Darth Indiana Bond wrote:
Caius wrote:
I read that this was actually requested by the Obama Administration. My thought is that it is abominable. If captured outside the United States and on a battlefield, fine, lock them away without any habeas corpus rights for the remainder of hostilities and preferably in some secret prison in a friendly dictators country.


Except Obama plans to veto the bill:

http://www.allvoices.com/contributed-ne ... ns-of-veto



Yeah I was going to say that too. I thought he was against this bill.


What relevance is that to my statement? My understanding is the Administration's veto threat concerned Guantanamo type issues.

http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/SenateSession4951

Go to the 4:43 mark and you can hear Democratic Senator Carl Levin on the floor of the Senate say just what I said. That the Obama administration pushed for the removal of the language which would have exempted U.S. Citizens from such indefinite detention.


What the hell are you talking about? I think that's what you want him to say more than what he actually stated. It would seem as though the president does have some desire to get something like this passed, but the senators drones on about how the bill is not developed enough, and later on states how the bill as it is could override 200 years of legal work, and how the bill as it currently exists could have horrible side effects.


Okay, so I've gone back and re-listened to the clip you provided. I apologize for saying things a little too hastedly, and now I see your point. My counter still stands that the senator from Colorado does state that the president wants to review the stated amendment, and that's his desire to pull the amendment out.

_________________
Image


Thu Dec 08, 2011 3:15 am
Profile
007
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2005 11:43 pm
Posts: 10986
Location: Wouldn't you like to know
Post Re: National Defense Authorization Act
In fact, when John McCain takes the floor, he gets pretty passionate about his frustration with Obama having an issue with the whole situation concerning the bill stripping away Miranda Rights

_________________
Image


Thu Dec 08, 2011 3:19 am
Profile
Killing With Kindness
User avatar

Joined: Mon Oct 11, 2004 8:57 pm
Posts: 25020
Location: Anchorage,Alaska
Post Re: National Defense Authorization Act
Mannyisthebest wrote:
Frankly the govt has been able to able to lock up people and hold them for a long time anyways (look at what happened after 9/11) and can simply suspend habeas corpus in a time of war.

Also, Obama could veto it but he will use drones to kill any threat (own citizen) it appears and imo I think there is nothing wrong with that.

I prefer they would not be able to do it easily.

_________________
The Force Awakens

Image


Thu Dec 08, 2011 4:22 am
Profile WWW
Killing With Kindness
User avatar

Joined: Mon Oct 11, 2004 8:57 pm
Posts: 25020
Location: Anchorage,Alaska
Post Re: National Defense Authorization Act
Darth Indiana Bond wrote:
In fact, when John McCain takes the floor, he gets pretty passionate about his frustration with Obama having an issue with the whole situation concerning the bill stripping away Miranda Rights

How does Mcshame still have any influence.

_________________
The Force Awakens

Image


Thu Dec 08, 2011 4:22 am
Profile WWW
Forum General
User avatar

Joined: Wed May 10, 2006 3:53 pm
Posts: 8636
Location: Toronto, Canada
Post Re: National Defense Authorization Act
John McCain is a very well known guy and is a senior senator...

His influence has waned but it is still high.

_________________
The Dark Prince

Image


Thu Dec 08, 2011 8:31 am
Profile WWW
Wall-E
User avatar

Joined: Thu Feb 17, 2005 5:25 pm
Posts: 855
Post Re: National Defense Authorization Act
And what is the point of this legislation but to overthrow Due Process and deny a fair hearing?
The government already has the power to hold dangerous suspects without bail. A defense attorney isn't going to be able to contradict reasonable evidence.
Even O.J. was in jail for a year before his case went to trial and he wasn't even a terrorist.


Thu Dec 08, 2011 9:34 am
Profile WWW
Extraordinary

Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 1:13 pm
Posts: 15197
Location: Planet Xatar
Post Re: National Defense Authorization Act
As Jon Stewart pointed out last night, it is sufficient evidence for detaining a US citizen indefinitely without charges or trial under this new law, if you are found with more than a seven day supply of food in your house.

Of course, this is only another nail in the coffin - - American freedom died quite some time ago.

:(


Thu Dec 08, 2011 10:51 am
Profile
Extraordinary
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 11, 2005 9:51 pm
Posts: 11637
Post Re: National Defense Authorization Act
Caius wrote:
Jedi Master Carr wrote:
Darth Indiana Bond wrote:
Caius wrote:
I read that this was actually requested by the Obama Administration. My thought is that it is abominable. If captured outside the United States and on a battlefield, fine, lock them away without any habeas corpus rights for the remainder of hostilities and preferably in some secret prison in a friendly dictators country.


Except Obama plans to veto the bill:

http://www.allvoices.com/contributed-ne ... ns-of-veto



Yeah I was going to say that too. I thought he was against this bill.


What relevance is that to my statement? My understanding is the Administration's veto threat concerned Guantanamo type issues.

http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/SenateSession4951

Go to the 4:43 mark and you can hear Democratic Senator Carl Levin on the floor of the Senate say just what I said. That the Obama administration pushed for the removal of the language which would have exempted U.S. Citizens from such indefinite detention.



Well I heard something different on CNN. They said Obama was threatening a veto over that part of the bill.


Thu Dec 08, 2011 3:04 pm
Profile WWW
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Reply to topic   [ 19 posts ] 

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group.
Designed by STSoftware for PTF.