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 The Biden era: The Establishment Strikes Back 

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 The Biden era: The Establishment Strikes Back 
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Post Re: Democratic Primary: Biden/Harris 2020
Malcolm wrote:
Shack wrote:
Much like how his legitimate mistake in the McCain comments were used as political ammo in the losers and suckers story, no surprise to me that they did the same thing with the pussy tape and dug up another sexual assault accuser as a September/October surprise. It may backfire though as they had successfully buried the Tara Reade story for months which may come back now.


There are *dozens* of Trump accusers, FYI--though I'm sure you have excellent reasons why all those women should be dismissed but Reade should be heard. :roll:

Anyway, I find those identifying themselves as woke leftists to often be deeply annoying & proudly moronic but I'm not sure how some people come to the conclusion that religious zealots & neo-Nazis are preferable (if Biden gets lumped in with woke idiots then Trump gets Nazis/white supremacists--seems fair). The difference in how the two men handle the extremes of their party should make perfectly clear how hollow many of these anti-Biden arguments really are.

Biden has denounced or simply ignored much of what the far left regularly screams about (abolish/defund police, sex is a made up construct, "cancel" people for XYZ, riots are justice, etc) whereas Trump often applauds/welcomes the support of his far right base by quite openly applauding their efforts (white supremacist marches, Q-anon conspiracy nonsense, religious zealots shouting how Covid is a hoax, encouraging voter fraud, etc). Biden does NOT represent the far left whereas Trump does represent the far right, so if you dislike both the far right & the far left then voting Biden should really be an easy decision--in an insane world, he is the sanest choice.

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Sanity and reason have largely gone out the window, though, so who knows where we're headed. :thumbsup:


You can claim Biden has semi-distanced himself from the radical left (which is debatable, you can still say he has the most left platform of any major candidate in history), but the Democrat party as a whole has clearly embraced the woke more than the Republicans. Democrat governors and mayors have legitimately defunded police, taken away weapons like tear gas and released rioters, and they are the party with real woke people in congress like the Squad. This is relevant because I can only assume Biden's presidency would be the most by "committee" in history due to limit the load on him physically and mentally. The risk is not really that Biden has legit socialist beliefs, it's that he may be weak enough to let the real socialists push him around.





What does president Biden do if the left riots and says "Giving us what we want is the only way to stop the violence" Does he appease them? If I was the woke mob, Biden is exactly who I would want as president. I would want someone I can bully into bowing to them instead of a guy giving them the middle finger in Trump.

And Trump is actually moderate right once you get past the blatant media misinformation. I would define far right or far left as "radical" or desiring significant changes in either direction. I think it would make more sense to call "far right" libertarian personally instead of it being used to call someone a nazi poopyhead as the left now uses it, but either way his message is clearly more the preservation of America right now than making a radical change in my opinion. The moderate, anti-radicalism votes in this election should actually be agreeing with Trump's policies. Giving the Democrats power is the radical change choice, if you think America is broken in areas like race and police and needs to be "fixed".

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Fri Sep 18, 2020 11:51 am
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Post Re: Democratic Primary: Biden/Harris 2020
Good lord, do you actually believe the crap you say, Shack? :funny:


Fri Sep 18, 2020 2:40 pm
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Post Re: Democratic Primary: Biden/Harris 2020
So Pennsylvania will allow mail in ballots to be counted 3 days after the election even if they aren't postmarked, and banned the Green Party, who got 49,000 votes in the state last time in a state Trump won by 44,000 (they were also banned in Wisconsin where they had 31,000 votes in a state Trump won by 23,000). Michigan, which he won by 10,000 votes, will allow ballots 2 weeks after and made ballot harvesting legal. I hope whoever wins does it in a landslide and it's called the night of, because if the Democrats win cause they found just enough lost ballots in Michigan in the 2 weeks after election day or something, a lot of people will be calling bullshit.

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Fri Sep 18, 2020 5:12 pm
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Post Re: Democratic Primary: Biden/Harris 2020
Libs wrote:
Good lord, do you actually believe the crap you say, Shack? :funny:


Trump/Rep operatives: Biden is controlled by crazy Bernie and the radical left.
Also Trump/Rep operatives: Biden stole the primary from crazy Bernie.

Trump/Rep operatives: Biden is sleepy and has dementia.
Also Trump/Rep operatives: Biden memorized all the questions and answers for his town hall. Otherwise, how could he have known he would be asked about the pandemic? How could he have given reasonable answers about Trump's botched pandemic response?



Fri Sep 18, 2020 7:33 pm
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Post Re: Democratic Primary: Biden/Harris 2020
I'd like to be able to discuss the reality of things as someone who's always considered himself an independent (and couldn't have been less excited by Biden), but the Shacks of the world remind me of people like Ben Shapiro, Dave Rubin, and Saagar Enjeti. They often present themselves as Republicans who aren't automatically anti-Democrat and are genuinely interested in debate leading to middle ground, but then they spew Republican talking point after talking point about how dangerous Democrats are while ignoring and/or defending Republican idiocy for apparently no other reason than it's their chosen side.

Everything Shack says about how Biden would be cowed by AOC and blah blah blah is pure speculative "what if?" nonsense since he has no actual argument as to how Biden=woke leftists because he doesn't. There's nearly four years of reality to judge Trump on but instead of focusing on any of that (I'm sure every failure of the last four years has nothing to do with the Republican administration in power) Shack opts to judge Biden on what he *might* do if this or that hypothetical leftist riot were to break out when Biden's already made it clear where he stands on violent protests & looting.

By the way, Shack's just like the leftists he claims are so dangerous by choosing to redefine words however works best for the chosen ideology with these ridiculous claims how "far right" should really mean Libertarian but "far left" still somehow falls under Biden's Democratic purview--because...well, because! The intellectual dishonesty is repulsive, to say the least.


Sat Sep 19, 2020 12:47 pm
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Post Re: Democratic Primary: Biden/Harris 2020
Malcolm wrote:
I'd like to be able to discuss the reality of things as someone who's always considered himself an independent (and couldn't have been less excited by Biden), but the Shacks of the world remind me of people like Ben Shapiro, Dave Rubin, and Saagar Enjeti. They often present themselves as Republicans who aren't automatically anti-Democrat and are genuinely interested in debate leading to middle ground, but then they spew Republican talking point after talking point about how dangerous Democrats are while ignoring and/or defending Republican idiocy for apparently no other reason than it's their chosen side.

Everything Shack says about how Biden would be cowed by AOC and blah blah blah is pure speculative "what if?" nonsense since he has no actual argument as to how Biden=woke leftists because he doesn't. There's nearly four years of reality to judge Trump on but instead of focusing on any of that (I'm sure every failure of the last four years has nothing to do with the Republican administration in power) Shack opts to judge Biden on what he *might* do if this or that hypothetical leftist riot were to break out when Biden's already made it clear where he stands on violent protests & looting.

By the way, Shack's just like the leftists he claims are so dangerous by choosing to redefine words however works best for the chosen ideology with these ridiculous claims how "far right" should really mean Libertarian but "far left" still somehow falls under Biden's Democratic purview--because...well, because! The intellectual dishonesty is repulsive, to say the least.


As an independent, this is my view as well.

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Sat Sep 19, 2020 1:35 pm
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Post Re: Democratic Primary: Biden/Harris 2020
Repubs playing with fire and risking utterly insane Dem turnout/ success if they pull any stunts before election day. No joke

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Sat Sep 19, 2020 2:04 pm
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Post Re: Democratic Primary: Biden/Harris 2020
Excel wrote:
Repubs playing with fire and risking utterly insane Dem turnout/ success if they pull any stunts before election day. No joke
We thought that in 2016. “there’s no way they’ll get away with stealing the seat from Obama.” The it happened anyways.

It’s infuriating, but not at all surprising. The party has nothing left but hypocrites, liars and cheaters. They are a blight upon the American people.

And they’ll probably get away with this to. Why should the people care about such corruption in government when ANTIFA IS COMING TO DESTROY YOUR SUBURBS. But Trump isn’t the type of guy who wants to cause a panic right? So I’m sure he will dial down that fearmongering rhetoric as we get closer to election day. RIGHT?


Sat Sep 19, 2020 2:14 pm
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Post Re: Democratic Primary: Biden/Harris 2020
Malcolm wrote:
Everything Shack says about how Biden would be cowed by AOC and blah blah blah is pure speculative "what if?" nonsense since he has no actual argument as to how Biden=woke leftists because he doesn't. There's nearly four years of reality to judge Trump on but instead of focusing on any of that (I'm sure every failure of the last four years has nothing to do with the Republican administration in power) Shack opts to judge Biden on what he *might* do if this or that hypothetical leftist riot were to break out when Biden's already made it clear where he stands on violent protests & looting.


As I said, Biden has already gone left from the primary to the general (as opposed to the normal move of moving to the center) and blue state governors have tried to do what the mob wants by defunding police in several cases.

So it's not a bunch of "what if" ness to say the Democrats may bow to the socialist agenda, there is already precedent supporting it.

Socialism is easily a bigger part of the Democrat party than neo-nazis or QAnon is in the Republicans. 5 of the most prominent Democrat congress voices including the runner up in the primary are socialists, and it’s clear a huge part of the Democrat voting base are young socialists which is why the Democrats are trying to appeal to them to get more enthusiastic voters. The only connection the Republicans have to neo-nazis is a Charlottesville quote where he denounced then 10 seconds later, and a response to QAnon question where Trump said “I don’t know much about them but it seems they like me”

And for the record I’m proudly anti-Democrat. I would define my position as far more a Democrat hater than I would being pro-Trump. I respect liberal views but I do not respect the Democrat party. I don’t say half of what I know that leads me to believe the Democrat party are the real boogeyman right now. In time people will see. I would love for there to be a different legitimate liberal party by 2024 that replaces the Democrats or for all the bad apples to be eliminated and replaced by clean Democrats. It has nothing to do with right being better than left, it's about this specific party falling to darkness and corruption. The reason I fear the Democrats trying to steal the election is if I'm right it means they're a wounded animal who will do anything to prevent four years of Trump, Barr and John Durham coming after them. This may all seem extreme to people who've been led to believe the complete opposite by the media, that the Republicans are the criminals who need to win the election to save themselves, but as I said I'm confident I will be proven right one way or the other (either Trump wins and the law catches up to the Democrats, or the Democrats win and controls society with force in way that reveals who they are)

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Sat Sep 19, 2020 2:24 pm
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Post Re: Democratic Primary: Biden/Harris 2020
Excel wrote:
Repubs playing with fire and risking utterly insane Dem turnout/ success if they pull any stunts before election day. No joke


You're thinking too highly of the GOP, dude. In less than 24-hours:

Less than 1 hour after news broke that RGB passed: McConnell releases statement that the Senate will have a floor vote to replace her.

Less than 1 hour-12 hours after RBG passed: Many GOP Senators have come out in support of filling her seat.

Less than 16 hours after RBG passed: Lindsey Graham, Trump's lap dog, has already said he will, "support [his owner] President Donald ["Master"] Trump in any effort to move forward regarding the recent vacancy created by the passing of Justice Ginsburg." The mutt even barked two-years ago on record that he'd wait like a good boy until the next election to do this if a spot opened up in Trump's last year of his first term, proudly saying we could use his barking against him.

Less than 20 hours after RGB passed: Trump is expected to announce his pick before the first debate next week.

I know there's all this risk, GOP Senators like Mutt Graham going on the record opposing this years ago, etc., and obviously the need to remain optimistic and hopeful, but dude, and guys, there's nothing to be hopeful for here. They're 100% going to do their best to replace her ASAP, before or after the election, it doesn't matter. This is a once in lifetime opportunity, their wet dream scenario, they'll risk everything, the Presidency, the Senate, their dignity..., to make happen. This is their purpose. Trump, especially, since this cements his legacy as a President, turning the Supreme Court strong conservative for decades to come, a court that could very well overturn Roe V Wade, Obamacare, many LGBTQ rights, human rights, etc. That's a big mark to leave behind.

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Sat Sep 19, 2020 4:12 pm
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Post Re: Democratic Primary: Biden/Harris 2020
Trump just needs to say one thing "We didn't block Obama's court nomination. That is fake news."

And voila, within his party, it is gone. No hypocrisy. No lies. Anything to keep with delusions like Shack's that the people who are constantly voting for human rights are actually more villainous than the people who deny those rights to everyone but themselves. It makes no sense but it doesn't have to. Conspiracies are more valuable than facts in their world.


Sat Sep 19, 2020 4:52 pm
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Post Re: Democratic Primary: Biden/Harris 2020
How come the Republicans are hypocrites for blocking the nomination in 2016 but supporting it now, but the Democrats aren't hypocrites for supporting an election year nomination in 2016 and now being against it? Didn't both sides flip their positions from 2016?

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Sat Sep 19, 2020 5:09 pm
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Post Re: Democratic Primary: Biden/Harris 2020
Because the Pubs are the ones who made it an issue that needed sides. If Merrick Garland was on the court right now then this would not be the thing people are immediately talking about following the death of an American Icon. In your world, sure the Democrats and their Vrrl overlords would certainly try to block Trump anyways, but for them the public relations hit would actually hurt. I know you scoff at the notion of moral integrity being the Key part of the Democratic agenda, but you cannot deny a good portion of the base does think this way. And pulling some stunt like this without being provoked would certainly not enforce that idea, it would push people towards the “both parties are the same” narrative.

Now though? It is an issue revolving around retaliation for injustice. I don’t know if you’ve noticed, but that sort of thing has been going around alot lately.


Sat Sep 19, 2020 5:39 pm
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Post Re: Democratic Primary: Biden/Harris 2020
I love when people make straw man arguments like “Republicans are against human rights!” And “Democrats are for hunan rights!” Lol.


Sat Sep 19, 2020 5:43 pm
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Post Re: Democratic Primary: Biden/Harris 2020
zwackerm wrote:
I love when people make straw man arguments like “Republicans are against human rights!” And “Democrats are for hunan rights!” Lol.


Who has said this? No one is saying that, at least here. Only the extremes of both sides make such statements (especially on social media).

And until you have to look up an employer's name, be a creep and search them up online and on social media to see if he or she has a history of anti-LGBTQ views before applying for a job, so you can have some comfort knowing you won't be fired for saying "love you" if your significant other comes to visit, you can't relate to how important this Supreme Court pick is to many people.

I've had to do just this in the past until the Supreme Court ruled this behavior as unconstitutional under the Civil Rights Act earlier this year (6-3), in 2020(!), because it was well within an employer's right to fire me (or anyone) because of my sexual orientation.

Simply put though, ideology, a liberal judge is much more likely to support human right cases or defend cases such as Roe v. Wade or a Bostock v. Clayton County (that I just mentioned), than a conservative judge would be. This isn't to say that liberals or conservatives always support one thing or another based on their beliefs, both Gorsuch and Roberts joined the liberal judges in the Bostock v. Clayton County ruling this year, simply that liberal judges are more favorable toward human and civil right cases.

Would I want a 9-0 (Liberal-Conservative) Supreme Court? Hell no. Ideally, I believe the courts should be balanced, but this isn't an ideal world is it?

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Sat Sep 19, 2020 6:10 pm
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Post Re: Democratic Primary: Biden/Harris 2020
$80 million in 24 hours for the Democrats.

Their turn-out is going insane y'all. Not a Democrat, just spitting facts. Get ready.

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Sun Sep 20, 2020 12:14 am
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Post Re: Democratic Primary: Biden/Harris 2020
No disrespect but WHY DIDN'T RBG RETIRE DURING OBAMA??

Shack wrote:
How come the Republicans are hypocrites for blocking the nomination in 2016 but supporting it now, but the Democrats aren't hypocrites for supporting an election year nomination in 2016 and now being against it? Didn't both sides flip their positions from 2016?


True but whatever actually occurred most recently (not confirmation) is seen as the precedent. That and Obama's nominee was like 9 months before the election. This is obviously much closer.

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Post Re: Democratic Primary: Biden/Harris 2020
The GOP made it such a point in 2016 that it was wrong to nominate a judge in an election year for the same politicians who made so much noise to all of the sudden turn face when the shoe is on the other foot... sorry Shack there is no intellectually honest way to defend this action without admitting this is hypocritical.

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Post Re: Democratic Primary: Biden/Harris 2020
In 2016, Obama nominated a Justice and then Senate decided not to vote on it, thereby the legislative branch flexed its power over executive and judicial branch. Trump nominating someone would be consistent executive action as Obama, and then it would be up to Senate to decide whether to vote on it.

Since the president’s action occurs first, then Democrats would be hypocritical first in not allowing consistent action as Obama in terms of the executive branch’s role. Afterwards, the referendum (from his district’s voters for re-election) would be on whether Mitch McConnell acts hypocritically, if he takes action before the election.

Democrat Party encourages rioters’ mob rule as 4th branch of government. There was no rioting from Republicans when Obama nominated a justice, but there will for sure be riots from Democrats as soon as Trump nominates one. I did not learn until recent months how much riots, looting, destruction, arson, and mob rule occurred back in the 60s to spur policy action, and had ignorantly accepted the false narrative that it was mainly peaceful protests decades ago that lead to policy change. Just like many people still aren’t realizing the difference between the peacefulness strategy of BLM during last decade not really affecting much, versus this year the mob violence, looting and destruction being the major difference in shifting political action and big business support.


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Post Re: Democratic Primary: Biden/Harris 2020
Alex Y. wrote:
I did not learn until recent months how much riots, looting, destruction, arson, and mob rule occurred back in the 60s to spur policy action, and had ignorantly accepted the false narrative that it was mainly peaceful protests decades ago that lead to policy change. Just like many people still aren’t realizing the difference between the peacefulness strategy of BLM during last decade not really affecting much, versus this year the mob violence, looting and destruction being the major difference in shifting political action and big business support.


No, the riots didn't help the civil rights movement in the 60s, that's the narrative that is wrong. The worst riots were in 1967 and then 1968 after MLK's death. The civil rights movement had already passed all its most important milestones by then. Rosa Parks refused to give up seat in 1955 and the most important milestones were in the ten years after that leading to the Civil Rights Act and Civil Rights Voting Acts passed in 1964 and 1965. Another way you can tell they were ineffective is that the late 60s riots were about police much like the current ones are, but did it have any real impact on policing laws, or stop things like Rodney King from happening? No. Finally I would point out that there were many race riots before the civil rights movement, for example after WWI there were many eventually leading to the Tulsa massacre I believe, but none of them led to civil rights like the peaceful protesting in the 60s. MLK's vision of non-violent protesting was effective, rioting was not. The only thing the rioting did was help cities like Detroit go in the shitter. I can't see how violence ever helps because anyone with money and common sense wouldn't want to live in a place they aren't safe, and every time you burn down a business there's a good chance they're going to rebulid it somewhere else. Minneapolis, Portland, Seattle, New York, etc. will likely suffer greatly in the long term from this year as many business owners or scared white and black middle class people have decided to get out, and in general every time property is damaged it takes money away from either the people or the city.

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Sun Sep 20, 2020 1:06 pm
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Post Re: Democratic Primary: Biden/Harris 2020
Darth Indiana Bond wrote:
The GOP made it such a point in 2016 that it was wrong to nominate a judge in an election year for the same politicians who made so much noise to all of the sudden turn face when the shoe is on the other foot... sorry Shack there is no intellectually honest way to defend this action without admitting this is hypocritical.
It’s not gonna be hard to sell the Trump base on the idea that the only black President should have to play by a different set of rules than all the white ones. It’s kinda their thing.


Sun Sep 20, 2020 2:57 pm
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Post Re: Democratic Primary: Biden/Harris 2020
I read that the Dems could delay it by impeaching Trump again. Meh.


Sun Sep 20, 2020 4:18 pm
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Post Re: Democratic Primary: Biden/Harris 2020
zwackerm wrote:
I love when people make straw man arguments like “Republicans are against human rights!” And “Democrats are for hunan rights!” Lol.
Yet you've never provided any evidence to the contrary...

They call Black Lives Matter a terrorist organization.
They put a travel ban on Muslim countries.
They booted transgenders out of the military.

This is just the current conservative party though. Perhaps they have a better record in the past.

Gay marriage? Oh no, gays will destroy our way of life.

Civil Rights? Nope, the blacks will destroy our way of life.

Women's suffrage? Nope, chicks voting will destroy our way of life

Slavery? Nope, over eight hundred thousand American soldiers had to die to make any progess on the issue. Then they continued to treat blacks like dogs for the next hundred years.

Conservative Romans when some guy is preaching a new way of looking at God? They killed him.

So yes, that's why I say the Republicans (the current conservative party) always put up a fight when it comes to giving people besides themselves more rights. They hold back the entire country with all their bullshit. People can be like "oh we should all work together" but they have no interest in that.

They allowed people like Trump and Moscow Mitch to ascend to the very highest levels of government. There is no hope for these people. I'd love to find some rational conservatives to come together and fix what ails our nation, but its never gonna hapen. I'm ready to put the whole lot of them into a rocket and shoot it towards Andromeda.


Sun Sep 20, 2020 10:07 pm
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Post Re: Democratic Primary: Biden/Harris 2020
Flava'd vs The World wrote:
zwackerm wrote:
I love when people make straw man arguments like “Republicans are against human rights!” And “Democrats are for hunan rights!” Lol.
Yet you've never provided any evidence to the contrary...

They call Black Lives Matter a terrorist organization.
They put a travel ban on Muslim countries.
They booted transgenders out of the military.

This is just the current conservative party though. Perhaps they have a better record in the past.

Gay marriage? Oh no, gays will destroy our way of life.

Civil Rights? Nope, the blacks will destroy our way of life.

Women's suffrage? Nope, chicks voting will destroy our way of life

Slavery? Nope, over eight hundred thousand American soldiers had to die to make any progess on the issue. Then they continued to treat blacks like dogs for the next hundred years.

Conservative Romans when some guy is preaching a new way of looking at God? They killed him.

So yes, that's why I say the Republicans (the current conservative party) always put up a fight when it comes to giving people besides themselves more rights. They hold back the entire country with all their bullshit. People can be like "oh we should all work together" but they have no interest in that.

They allowed people like Trump and Moscow Mitch to ascend to the very highest levels of government. There is no hope for these people. I'd love to find some rational conservatives to come together and fix what ails our nation, but its never gonna hapen. I'm ready to put the whole lot of them into a rocket and shoot it towards Andromeda.


They call the rioters terrorists but most Republicans think BLM has good aims it goes about badly.
Trans people were banned due to medical costs, and this has since been overturned and they’re allowed in now.
Countries that happened to be both Muslim majority and dangerous were banned temporarily, many dozens more Muslim majority countries were NOT banned. How is that “banning Muslims”?
Democrats did not support gay marriage until the Obama administration, and Republicans have largely taken a libertarian approach since acceptance of LGBT issues became mainstream in the late 00’s early 10’s.
It was the Democrat party that was against civil rights for blacks lol.
Republicans were not against the right to vote for women.
Again, it was Democrats who were for slavery.

But if you wanna believe your tin foil hat fantasy of what Republicans believe and have believed, feel free.


Sun Sep 20, 2020 10:29 pm
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Post Re: Democratic Primary: Biden/Harris 2020
"Terrorism is defined in the Code of Federal Regulations as “the unlawful use of force and violence against persons or property to intimidate or coerce a government, the civilian population, or any segment thereof, in furtherance of political or social objectives” (28 C.F.R.)” - First result on google

It’s not a huge reach to call riots by BLM and ANTIFA terrorism.

Sorry if that’s too much truth for some people.

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