Star Wars is still bigger domestically than the MCU, outside of Avengers (which is now over).

She's not perfect. I disagree with a few of her big decisions, and it has cost the Star Wars brand. But she's still running the ship. And overall, she's made it the success it is currently.

No...Star Wars is the success it is because of the original trilogy. Not because of anything she has done or added to the franchise. You are confusing "being in charge" with "being responsible"

She didn't create Star Wars, and she added absolutely nothing to it aside from the vision of releases every year (which I think we can both agree was a monumental mistake).

And you can't just 1) ignore WW totals, 2) ignore the domestic totals of the biggest MCU property (the avengers). The MCU is the current crown holder for biggest movie franchise. The RoS highlights it better than I could. The MCU had their franchise "finale" and it broke box office records. Star Wars had their franchise "finale" and it dropped precipitously from previous movies.

I wanted a separate one for this. Why do you think Avenger is "now over?"

It's going to be almost impossible for Marvel to recapture what they had with the original trio of RDJ/Evans/Hemsworth. They struck gold with RDJ, enough so that every movie he was in was a SMASH.

I just can't see that type of consistency happening again.

You may be right, but with the addition of the Fox properties (specifically mutants and the X-Men), there are going to be plenty of MCU event movies with Avengers.

Avengers v X-Men is the lowest hanging fruit, but that is the thing about Marvel, they have 60 years worth of material to pull from.

Considering what they have done with Guardians, Dr Strange and Black Panther, I think they will be fine from leading character standpoint.

Yeah, maybe in ten years when they actually start doing those films. By then, who knows what the market will be like. Hell, we could all be underwater by then.

You honestly think it will take Disney 10 years to do X-Men films? Starting in 2021 they are planning on FOUR MCU releases a year. We will have mutants making appearances in MCU movies in 2021/22 at the latest.

We will have the next big MCU event film within 3-4 years maybe sooner.

2023 will be the earliest we see a mutant character. At least 2024/2025 before we see an X-Men film.

A standalone film, you may be right as they need some time for the stink to wear off from Fox.

They will start retconning existing characters (Like Scarlett Witch) starting next year in Disney+. I am willing to bet we will start getting post credit call outs as early as The Eternals, with actual characters added to movies in 2021 (Strange Multiverse of Madness seems like a prime candidate) or 2022 (Black Panther 2)

JFC I hate Disney.

As long as the films match the existing MCU quality, I am all for it.

They have done 3 a year, and the quality of film has actually gone up in recent years

Agreeing with most of what you've been saying. I have in a separate thread a list of gaffes while KK is at the helm. Mind you, I've enjoyed all of the Disney SW films to varying degrees but with each project there's been decisions made, and then decisions reversed. People fired after it was revealed that they may not have had the "juice" (Trevorrow) or personality problems (Trank). It's too long of a list to not at least ascribe some blame to KK whose job is to wrangle talent and put together a production - all the way through to release.

Would I give her another chance? Sure. I love the idea of keeping Rian Johnson in the fold for whatever comes out in the 2020s and she is still one of the top producers. Who else would lead Lucasfilm? Dave Filoni is too junior and I'd rather Favreau make movies. She's still the one.

One thing I have learned in the corporate world is that more experience != better. Sometimes it does, but having the previous experience doesn't guarantee anything (especially when the previous experience lead to mixed results).

An actual Star Wars fan needs to lead this (ala Kevin Feige being a diehard comic fan). KK isn't that. She is a big business person, she doesn't care about the story, characters or fans. That is quite clear in how she runs things. In my opinion you need to pull of the bandaid, get someone fresh in there that truly cares, and let them learn trial by fire.

What if Kathleen Kennedy was Palpatine all along? Rocky and Bullwinkle crossover? Bring back Piper!

Imagine defending Krusty the Krab after these tragic overseas numbers and these last few joyless movies that are going to be completely forgotten in 5-10 years. At least the prequels were iconically bad at times and full of memes, plus the effects were revolutionary and the action scenes some of the all-time great. You can't even make fun of these new movies, they're just forgettable and bland all-around.

Some good points here.

What it boils down to overall is Disney/Lucasfilm messed up.

- They ignored George Lucas' story ideas for this 3rd trilogy and went their own way.
- Through a variety of bad decisions, they angered and divided many fans, and then with some continued bad decisions, continued to rub it in fans' faces.
- Instead of admitting their mistakes on bad decisions, in several instances Disney/Lucasfilm doubled down on their flawed thinking.
- Some of those involved acted extremely unprofessionally and should have been fired. Most egregiously, Kathleen Kennedy publicly criticized a lot of fans, and Rian Johnson on social media got into flame wars with fans, and continually trolled and criticized fans. That's a massive no-no one would think, and frankly I'm amazed that Kathleen Kennedy and Rian Johnson even still have careers left. The film industry can be a tough industry, and incompetence is almost never rewarded.

So due to absolute incompetence, Disney/Lucasfilm had a franchise that was one of the most hailed and revered franchises in film history, and now they've damaged it. Lots of rumors of production problems on the coming Kenobi show further continues to show the incompetence of Disney and Lucasfilm. Plenty of blame to go around, but it starts at the top. Iger and Kennedy are the most to blame, as they are the leaders who call the shots. From there the blame just goes down the list to various others.

Agree on these points.

And glutting the market with 5 Star Wars films in 4 years is unforgivable. Part of this was to re-coup their 2012 investment more quickly but the other part was to fast track content for Disney+ and thus resulted in quantity of quality.

It will take a long time to repair the damage done to the franchise and sadly I don't think it will ever be fully repaired.

Literally nobody with a brain would describe Kathleen Kennedy and Rian Johnson as "incompetent".