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 Black Panther $1.3b Worldwide Club DH2 Conquered! 
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Post Re: Black Panther $1B Worldwide Club Successful! On to 1.3b
Which is a telltale sign of a film that isn't a global phenom.


Sun Apr 01, 2018 7:32 pm
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Post Re: Black Panther $1B Worldwide Club Successful! On to 1.3b
That's what I was pointing at as well :thumbsup:

Its US breakout is more of factors aligning well in its favor and striking a cord with current movement(s).


Sun Apr 01, 2018 9:15 pm
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Post Re: Black Panther $1B Worldwide Club Successful! On to 1.3b
Magnus wrote:
Black Panther is going to do 625m+ OS. That's bigger than solo MCU films films like Thor 3 and Spider-Man: HC. It isn't a global phenom but I'm honestly as surprised by it doing 625m+ OS than it doing 650m+ DOM.


There are black people overseas, you know. ;)


Sun Apr 01, 2018 11:58 pm
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Post Re: Black Panther $1B Worldwide Club Successful! On to 1.3b
Still nothing can touch The Dark Knight

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Mon Apr 02, 2018 12:21 am
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Post Re: Black Panther $1B Worldwide Club Successful! On to 1.3b
Am I Missing Something Excel :huh:

The Dark Knight
*DBO-$533,345,358
*IBO- $468,275,260
*WW- $1,001,620,618

Adjusted for Inflation
*DBO- $683,575,000 (It will pass this)
*IBO- $613, 473,000
*WW- 1,297,048,000


Mon Apr 02, 2018 7:40 am
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Post Re: Black Panther $1B Worldwide Club Successful! On to 1.3b
Would love to know how you came to that overseas adjusted total.


Mon Apr 02, 2018 10:44 am
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Post Re: Black Panther $1B Worldwide Club Successful! On to 1.3b
Passionate Thug wrote:
Am I Missing Something Excel :huh:

The Dark Knight
*DBO-$533,345,358
*IBO- $468,275,260
*WW- $1,001,620,618

Adjusted for Inflation
*DBO- $683,575,000 (It will pass this)
*IBO- $613, 473,000
*WW- 1,297,048,000


His argument will be no 3D for TDK.

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Mon Apr 02, 2018 10:58 am
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Post Re: Black Panther $1B Worldwide Club Successful! On to 1.3b
I will start by noting that Mojo's adjusted chart is all over the place and there are numerous examples where common sense trumps their numbers. But:

Domestically, there is no 3D which adds a substantial boost. Even a puny 5% increase to the adjust gross puts it at an obviously out of BP's reach $717m. 3D likely adds in the ballpark of 10-15% which would give TDK a true inflated range $751 to $785m, which is consistent with it's truly insane gross back in 2008. It's $533m total was 60% higher than the 2007 winner, $25% higher than 2006 winer, 45% higher than the 2005 winner, $23% higher than the 2004 winner, etc. In the 5 years directly following TDK, only Avatar and Avengers topped it. Both films had insane 3D shares, particularly the former. It is arguable whether or not Avatar sold more tickets than TDK while TDK clearly sold more tickets than Avengers. Even with inflation, at time of opening, TDK was clearly the highest grossing film in 9 years (since Episode 1). TDK finished it's run as the obvious #2 film of all time and there was (brief) debate as to whether it could dethrone Titanic.

While BP is a true megahit, it won't come close to even Jurassic World's inflated numbers and there are still some who think it will not win the year (find that very likely though IMO). It obviously is a huge hit but it simply is not the transcendently massive hit TDK was.

Internationally, that is with no China, and obviously overseas markets have developed significantly in last 10 years. A base inflation adjustment to $613.5m is obviously much below what it would actually do were the conditions replicated today.

I would say that with adjusted prices and correct 3D sboost, TDK's domestic gross is in the $760m range. Overseas, with inflation, 3D, and China, it's $950m for $1.7b worldwide which is consistent with it's 2008 reputation as bigger than pretty much everything else sans Titanic domestically and overseas and Return of the King internationally.

In pop culture, TDK remains by far the most influential movie of the new millennium. The Austin package bomber even quoted the Joker during his confession. :( The movie touched people souls.

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Mon Apr 02, 2018 11:40 am
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Post Re: Black Panther $1B Worldwide Club Successful! On to 1.3b
It's certainly in the league of The Dark Knight, though Excel is right that Black Panther will probably sell a few less tickets.


Mon Apr 02, 2018 12:42 pm
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Post Re: Black Panther $1B Worldwide Club Successful! On to 1.3b
Excel wrote:
It is arguable whether or not Avatar sold more tickets than TDK while TDK clearly sold more tickets than Avengers.


Avatar - 95.9m tickets / 97.3m lifetime tickets
The Avengers - 76.8m tickets
The Dark Knight - 74.2m tickets / 74.4 lifetime tickets
Black Panther - 70.8m tickets

I don't think that's arguable. If you want to argue that the estimate might be off between The Avengers and The Dark Knight, have fun, but Avatar sold more tickets than The Dark Knight.

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Mon Apr 02, 2018 2:40 pm
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Post Re: Black Panther $1B Worldwide Club Successful! On to 1.3b
Jmart wrote:
Excel wrote:
It is arguable whether or not Avatar sold more tickets than TDK while TDK clearly sold more tickets than Avengers.


Avatar - 95.9m tickets / 97.3m lifetime tickets
The Avengers - 76.8m tickets
The Dark Knight - 74.2m tickets / 74.4 lifetime tickets
Black Panther - 70.8m tickets

I don't think that's arguable. If you want to argue that the estimate might be off between The Avengers and The Dark Knight, have fun, but Avatar sold more tickets than The Dark Knight.


Math.

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/news/?id=2657&p=.htm

Quote:
Avatar's 3D presentations have accounted for 72 percent or $1.35 billion of its total gross. Breaking that down, 3D's domestic share is 80 percent, and its foreign share is 69 percent. That's far and away the biggest 3D gross ever, and Avatar's effectively most people's first sampling of the new-fangled 3D technology.


$750m final gross. 80% were 3d tickets = $604m w/ 3D, $146m no 3D
Estimated 3D ticket increase of 50% ($8ish to $12ish)
$604m becomes $400m when 3D surcharge is subtracted
$400m + $146m =$546m total at end of it's run in April 2010
TDK adjusted gross to April 2010 = $562m

Not picking a side. But Avatar's 3D share of 80% needs to be factored correctly. The two were quite close with TDK clearly being the more influential over pop culture.

As for Avengers:
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/news/?id=3438&p=.htm
3D accounted for 52% opening weekend and 44% at end of run
$623m total
$349m no 3D
$274m with 3D = $180m with 3d subtracted
$349+$180m = $529m total at end of run August 2012
TDK adjusted to August 2012 = $570m

WB cost themselves stupid amounts of money by not pushing for INCEPTION and TDKR to be in 3D. It tremendously inflated grosses relative to tickets sold from 2009-2014ish.

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Last edited by Excel on Mon Apr 02, 2018 3:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Mon Apr 02, 2018 2:50 pm
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Post Re: Black Panther $1B Worldwide Club Successful! On to 1.3b
Couldn't you spin that the other way and say that Avatar is more impressive since 80% of its audience was willing to pay the extra $4 on average to see it (repeatedly)? 80% of the audience didn't have to pay the surcharge.

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Mon Apr 02, 2018 2:59 pm
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Post Re: Black Panther $1B Worldwide Club Successful! On to 1.3b
Excel wrote:
In the 5 years directly following TDK, only Avatar and Avengers topped it. Both films had insane 3D shares, particularly the former. It is arguable whether or not Avatar sold more tickets than TDK while TDK clearly sold more tickets than Avengers. Ummmm..

Passionate Thug wrote:
Total estimated sold Ticket sales as of 3/26
Per Gitesh-
Avengers- 72M
BlackPanther- 70M
DarkKnight- 68M
Age of Ultron- 52M


In pop culture, TDK remains by far the most influential movie of the new millennium. The Austin package bomber even quoted the Joker during his confession. :( The movie touched people souls.

As much as I love "The Dark Knight" as a film and have it ranked in my top 3 Super Hero Movies. It just did not touch the cultural impact that Panther has. Im sorry Heath Ledgers death had the same impact that Paul Walkers death had on FF7. People are morbidly over supportive of tragedy. The good thing is this was Heath Ledgers career defining performance and really sold the movie.

This is a great article looking back on it. I don't agree with everything he espouses but he makes some good points.

http://moviebob.blogspot.com/2015/09/th ... ctive.html

THE DARK KNIGHT was now poised not only to re-chart the course of its entire genre, but of the entire industry, all the way up to its yearly awards bonanzas.

And then… it didn’t.

It’s hard to put a finger on when it became fully apparent that THE DARK KNIGHT was a paper tiger as far as movement firebrands go. Maybe it wasn’t truly visible until its own sequel, THE DARK KNIGHT RISES, landed as a dreary, convoluted slog a few years later. But it feels apparent now, and increasingly so as each new superhero-blockbuster goes by, that the notion of Nolan’s prestige-format Bat-opus as the transformative moment of the genre was both premature and over-sold. Its expected influence over subsequent comic-adaptations has waned, almost no one involved has moved that much further in their careers and even its own studio appears to be in no small hurry to change directions.

In fact, I’d say that it’s worth positing that, outside of its own individual lasting popularity, THE DARK KNIGHT has had almost NO substantial, lasting impact. Not on film, not on the popular-culture, not on comics and not even on Batman. And that feels close to astonishing considering how sure the entire cinematic world was that it had experienced a GODFATHER-level sea change.



Mon Apr 02, 2018 3:01 pm
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Post Re: Black Panther $1B Worldwide Club Successful! On to 1.3b
Jmart wrote:
Couldn't you spin that the other way and say that Avatar is more impressive since 80% of its audience was willing to pay the extra $4 on average to see it (repeatedly)? 80% of the audience didn't have to pay the surcharge.

Its impressive on its own but useless in a comparison as we have no idea how many TDK people would have said the same.

The point is that Avengers and especially Avatars enormous 3D shares totally inflate it's grosses. There's no real way Avengers sold more tickets than TDK and Avatar is debatable. Fair statements.

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Mon Apr 02, 2018 3:03 pm
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Post Re: Black Panther $1B Worldwide Club Successful! On to 1.3b
Passionate Thug wrote:
As much as I love "The Dark Knight" as a film and have it ranked in my top 3 Super Hero Movies. It just did not touch the cultural impact that Panther has. Im sorry Heath Ledgers death had the same impact that Paul Walkers death had on FF7. People are morbidly over supportive of tragedy. The good thing is this was Heath Ledgers career defining performance and really sold the movie.


That article is comical. Is that serious? Even the comments are calling him out as an idiot.

TDK is THE reason why the BP nominations category went from 5 to 10.
TDK weds first non Star Wars to make midnight grosses an event
Why So Serious, Hero We Need, World Burn, Die a Hero or Become The Villain are still quoted on a regular basis
HL Joker is by far the most iconic villain of 21st century and to this day is still a popular mask
Skyfall, The Winter Soldier, Amazing Spider-man, Apes trilogy, and a host of other big films were blatant attempts to mimic TDK's tone
TDK is ranked #4 on IMDB all time near 10 years after release and is the consensus super hero movie
TDKR opening weekend is topped only by FORCE AWAKES in terms of measurable hype. $31m from just midnights with no 3D and 2012 ticket prices. Good lord.

Also..the point about the actors is absurd. Ledger post-Joker would have been a complete megastar. TDK also solidified Nolan is as a director with insane star power.

Black Panther, on the other hand? What impacts there beyond that there AA audience is a huge market, just as Avatar showed that the 3D market was huge, JW showed Dino's are huge, ASvangers showed team ups are huge, etc. There is not ONE THING about the substance of BP that is new or revolutionary. It's style will no doubt be mimicked, but thats nothing.

Anybody with a hint of common sense knows the internet would break if Nolan announced TDK 4 tomorrow.

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Last edited by Excel on Mon Apr 02, 2018 3:23 pm, edited 2 times in total.



Mon Apr 02, 2018 3:17 pm
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Post Re: Black Panther $1B Worldwide Club Successful! On to 1.3b
Excel wrote:
Jmart wrote:
Couldn't you spin that the other way and say that Avatar is more impressive since 80% of its audience was willing to pay the extra $4 on average to see it (repeatedly)? 80% of the audience didn't have to pay the surcharge.

Its impressive on its own but useless in a comparison as we have no idea how many TDK people would have said the same.


Right. It is useless. Christopher Nolan doesn't make 3D films.

Quote:
The point is that Avengers and especially Avatars enormous 3D shares totally inflate it's grosses. There's no real way Avengers sold more tickets than TDK and Avatar is debatable. Fair statements.


No. I just provided the numbers. The other two sold more tickets. If you want to debate whether or not Avengers and Avatar would've sold the same amount of tickets if 3D wasn't an option, fine (Avengers probably would've / Avatar probably wouldn't have since that was the whole hook of the movie), but that's just a waste of time.

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Mon Apr 02, 2018 3:19 pm
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Post Re: Black Panther $1B Worldwide Club Successful! On to 1.3b
Jmart wrote:
No. I just provided the numbers. The other two sold more tickets. If you want to debate whether or not Avengers and Avatar would've sold the same amount of tickets if 3D wasn't an option, fine (Avengers probably would've / Avatar probably wouldn't have since that was the whole hook of the movie), but that's just a waste of time.


Did you stop taking math classes in 3rd grade? What numbers did you provide that dispelled the fairly basic equation of subtracting the 3D charge and then totaling the grosses?

Avengers would have sold the same number of tickets without 3D, Avatars obviously would have declined significantly.

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Mon Apr 02, 2018 3:22 pm
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Post Re: Black Panther $1B Worldwide Club Successful! On to 1.3b
Pop culturally Excel is right, at least as of right now. We'll see where Black Panther is in ten years (it'll be more impactful than Avatar and its sequels).

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Mon Apr 02, 2018 3:23 pm
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Post Re: Black Panther $1B Worldwide Club Successful! On to 1.3b
Excel wrote:
Passionate Thug wrote:
As much as I love "The Dark Knight" as a film and have it ranked in my top 3 Super Hero Movies. It just did not touch the cultural impact that Panther has. Im sorry Heath Ledgers death had the same impact that Paul Walkers death had on FF7. People are morbidly over supportive of tragedy. The good thing is this was Heath Ledgers career defining performance and really sold the movie.


That article is comical. Is that serious? Even the comments are calling him out as an idiot.

TDK is THE reason why the BP nominations category went from 5 to 10.
TDK weds first non Star Wars to make midnight grosses an event
Why So Serious, Hero We Need, World Burn, Die a Hero or Become The Villain are still quoted on a regular basis
HL Joker is by far the most iconic villain of 21st century and to this day is still a popular mask
Skyfall, The Winter Soldier, Amazing Spider-man, Apes trilogy, and a host of other big films were blatant attempts to mimic TDK's tone
TDK is ranked #4 on IMDB all time near 10 years after release and is the consensus super hero movie
TDKR opening weekend is topped only by FORCE AWAKES in terms of measurable hype. $31m from just midnights with no 3D and 2012 ticket prices. Good lord.

Also..the point about the actors is absurd. Ledger post-Joker would have been a complete megastar. TDK also solidified Nolan is as a director with insane star power.

Black Panther, on the other hand? What impacts there beyond that there AA audience is a huge market, just as Avatar showed that the 3D market was huge, JW showed Dino's are huge, ASvangers showed team ups are huge, etc. There is not ONE THING about the substance of BP that is new or revolutionary. It's style will no doubt be mimicked, but thats nothing.


Oh this is getting fun..... :D

Quote:
Why So Serious, Hero We Need, World Burn, Die a Hero or Become The Villain are still quoted on a regular basis
Vs.
Quote:
Wakanda Forever, I Neva Freeze, I accept your Challenge, Hey Auntie, Colonizer, Long live the king, Bury me in the ocean with my ancestors who jumped from the ships, because they knew death was better than bondage.


Next

Quote:
HL Joker is by far the most iconic villain of 21st century and to this day is still a popular mask
vs.
Quote:
MBJ Killmonger is just as iconic. And he already becoming one of the best actors in hollywood with 3 powerful performance already under his belt with more guaranteed to come in the next few years.


Also

Quote:
TDK is ranked #4 on IMDB all time near 10 years after release and is the consensus super hero movie
vs
Quote:
TDK has a 94% (326 reviews) RT score but Black Panther has 97% (365 Reviews) on RT


Lastly

Quote:
Black Panther, on the other hand? What impacts there beyond that there AA audience is a huge market
vs
Quote:
AA are 13% of the population which means It needed a hell of a lot of help from other races and ethnic groups, Black Panther/Killmonger was a C to D list character/Villian not one of Comics Top 2 like Batman/Joker, After 17 films in the Marvel Juggernaut in one fell swoop he will take the reigns of where the MCU will go- Not Iron Man, Spiderman, Thor, or Hulk.


Last edited by Passionate Thug on Mon Apr 02, 2018 3:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Mon Apr 02, 2018 3:43 pm
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Post Re: Black Panther $1B Worldwide Club Successful! On to 1.3b
Excel wrote:
It is arguable whether or not Avatar sold more tickets than TDK while TDK clearly sold more tickets than Avengers.


Jmart wrote:
No. I just provided the numbers. The other two sold more tickets. If you want to debate whether or not Avengers and Avatar would've sold the same amount of tickets if 3D wasn't an option, fine (Avengers probably would've / Avatar probably wouldn't have since that was the whole hook of the movie), but that's just a waste of time.


Excel wrote:
Did you stop taking math classes in 3rd grade? What numbers did you provide that dispelled the fairly basic equation of subtracting the 3D charge and then totaling the grosses?

Avengers would have sold the same number of tickets without 3D, Avatars obviously would have declined significantly.


When did you stop taking English?

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Mon Apr 02, 2018 4:43 pm
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Post Re: Black Panther $1B Worldwide Club Successful! On to 1.3b
Did you just say, in a serious manner, that MBJ's Killmonger is as iconic as Ledger's Joker?

Oscar winner. Voted 2nd greatest film villain of all time. Call me when Killmonger starts a nation wide craze.

Image

Image

Image

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Mon Apr 02, 2018 4:51 pm
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Post Re: Black Panther $1B Worldwide Club Successful! On to 1.3b
Passionate Thug wrote:
Quote:
Wakanda Forever, I Neva Freeze, I accept your Challenge, Hey Auntie, Colonizer, Long live the king, Bury me in the ocean with my ancestors who jumped from the ships, because they knew death was better than bondage.


Nobody says those now, let alone in 10 years. I'm not seeing references to BP on ESPN for example. It hasn't permeated culture that deep.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DmdOX5Nzi2s

Quote:
HL Joker is by far the most iconic villain of 21st century and to this day is still a popular mask
vs.
Quote:
MBJ Killmonger is just as iconic. And he already becoming one of the best actors in hollywood with 3 powerful performance already under his belt with more guaranteed to come in the next few years.


Just wrong as stated above. Ledger has made it impossible for anybody to really tackle the role for the last decade and probably a good while longer. His character is still so common in pop culture. People have not moved on or forgotten his take on the character. It's likely pissing WB off. They thought people would get excited over a solo Joker movie, but everybody just got upset because they're not over HL.

Quote:
TDK is ranked #4 on IMDB all time near 10 years after release and is the consensus super hero movie
vs
Quote:
TDK has a 94% (326 reviews) RT score but Black Panther has 97% (365 Reviews) on RT


RT score comp means nothing. There are a handful more people who disliked TDK than BP. There are scores more that found TDK much better than BP hence its much better IMDb rating.

Quote:
Black Panther, on the other hand? What impacts there beyond that there AA audience is a huge market
vs
Quote:
AA are 13% of the population which means It needed a hell of a lot of help from other races and ethnic groups, Black Panther/Killmonger was a C to D list character/Villian not one of Comics Top 2 like Batman/Joker, After 17 films in the Marvel Juggernaut in one fell swoop he will take the reigns of where the MCU will go- Not Iron Man, Spiderman, Thor, or Hulk.


Timing matters. BP is a cool story told well and was a huge breath of fresh air. Be happy with what it is as opposed to arguing about what it isn't. :thumbsup: It's sequel may be, for we all know. BP is certainly bigger than BB was.

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Post Re: Black Panther $1B Worldwide Club Successful! On to 1.3b
Algren wrote:
Magnus wrote:
Black Panther is going to do 625m+ OS. That's bigger than solo MCU films films like Thor 3 and Spider-Man: HC. It isn't a global phenom but I'm honestly as surprised by it doing 625m+ OS than it doing 650m+ DOM.


There are black people overseas, you know. ;)


Also its quite common for these breakouts in US to get a decent run in OS markets as people get excited to know what the buzz is about.


Mon Apr 02, 2018 9:34 pm
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Post Re: Black Panther $1.3b Worldwide Club 2nd Goal Achieved!!
As of 4/8
Domestic- $665.6m
International- $635m
Worldwide Total- $1,300,111,825

Next up taking down
- The Last Jedi $1,332.6b (33m to go)
- Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows Part 2 $1,341.5b (35m to go)

Wakanda Forever!!


Mon Apr 09, 2018 6:33 pm
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Post Re: Black Panther $1.3b Worldwide Club 2nd Goal Achieved!
TLJ and DH2 are both locks to go down even though it seem to have slowed down considerably in OS markets.


Mon Apr 09, 2018 9:42 pm
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