I guess it's finally happening...

... I think people are sick of "... it's fine" movies and that's literally what MCU is serving for the most part. If the films all start to falter hopefully they'll put more effort into making them great.

Yeah, it’s definitely a quality problem, otherwise we would’ve experienced this far sooner.

I hope we still dont have a huge breakout and we get "reports of my demise were greatly exaggerated".

The next billion dollar film will be the next Avengers film probably. Or
Spider-Man 4 whichever comes first. Deadpool 3 is a wildcard but idk how it can do enough overseas to do that.

All of Phase 5 has the chance to disappoint tbh.

Well made Superman movie has a chance. he is an easy sell and we have not had a strong Superman movies since Superman 2 with Reeves. Plus any move to tie to wider DCU will spark further excitement for sure.

Cannot sleep on Joker 2 as well though its unlikely to recreate the magic the 1st one did.

MCU side Deadpool or even a strong Fantastic Four could keep it in play.

We're barely a year past NWH being one of the biggest box office hits ever. It is all about quality and freshness.

Marvel became far too oversaturated and ran into quality problems to boot.

People tolerated the occasional average film because they were part of the wider infinity saga. This is no longer the case as Marvel films have become weaker and are part of a new “multiverse storyline” that is less compelling. There is far less heft to each film abs like everything in life - the novelty is gone.

That doesn’t mean individual films won’t still break out - they will. It’s the overall trend that is on the decline.

I'm pretty sure something has shifted but I'm not sure if it's MCU or superhero, Shazam 2 flop could be a coincidence, DC has always had some boom or bust record for superhero movies. If Guardians does poorly and the Flash does well, it seems like it would be more of an MCU thing.

Important to note Spider-Man: No Way Home wasn't really huge because of the MCU association, but because of the Sam Riami trilogy association. It was the perfect moment to capitalize on nostalgia for the 2000s franchise. The big selling point was seeing those original characters and actors again, not because Tony Stark or Thor were going to be in it.

People got bored. Honestly, it was about time too.

Are you doing okay?

Think if it gets REALLY bad they'll bring RDJ back somehow. They'll offer him $100M or something but he started the MCU with the original so would be fitting to have him come back to save it.

I think at some point both RDJ/CE would come back for sure. Losing CB made this phase lot worse than otherwise.

Black Adam's $67M opening doesn't look so bad anymore. Hell even Morbius' $38M would seem good if it had released a year later haha.

Weird how this year will go down as a loss for the superhero genre when, quality wise, it produced two of the all time best with Spiderverse and Guardians.

Well those also happen to be by far the two highest grossing comic book movies this year, that’s good right?

I must admit to a little schadenfreude about the whole thing, I’ve been mostly tired of the Marvel machine for many years.

What’s next? I think if The Marvels manages to gross 50% of Captain Marvel that’d be a win. Could miss…

One could make the argument that Spiderman, not Batman or the Avengers won the first quarter century of the 2000s. Even despite the Garfield movies, TDK’s preeminence, and the behemoth that is Endgame. I dunno, it’s probably the Avengers but the staying power of Spiderman is truly impressive. It sparked this SH renaissance in 2002 and is still going strong.

Overall yeah, but I'm just talking about how this year will be remembered as the downfall of the genre even with those two gems. And we still have two superhero films coming up that are far from guaranteed winners.

Well it took 6 years but we are in the superhero fatigue stage of comic movies with Marvels / Flash /Shazam / Antman and likely Aquaman the brunt of it.

Will help improve the quality of films overall but signs like GOTG3's recovery still show people will show up for quality.

They need to start approaching superhero genre like it’s 2003 not 2023. No more B tier characters, Captain Marvel and Aquaman probably wouldn’t have made it in mid 2000s any more than Affleck Daredevil or Catwoman. Build around the alphas Superman, Batman and Spiderman, except the latter two are beaten into the ground, so it’s a great time for first beloved Superman movies since Reeves. Maybe recast Wonder Woman, try X-men and F4 one more time and if RDJ wants to come back for Iron Man let him do his thing.

They're all overexposed. RDJ coming back feels wrong after how perfect (and laborious) of a send-off Endgame was. X-Men was so overdone that it resulted in diminshing returns for a while until the franchise imploded with Dark Phoenix. There have been three Batmans in the last 11 years. F4 has been tried twice and never fully worked. Spider-Man obviously can still produce a huge movie but they've ran out of iconic villains at this point and it's all downhill from here after exploiting nostalgia with the last one.

I think Hollywood needs to leave superheroes alone for a decade and then they will eventually feel fresh and cool again. But there is no property that audiences are itching for another version of IMO.

As much as these movies bombing, Success of Barbenheimer, Mario and Even Freddys(at least pre release) is showing there are movies that make audience excited for sure.

Spider-verse 2's performance where it doubled it's predecessor vs Marvels where it'll do 20% of its predecessor is such a weird contrast!

All of those were something fresh though. Barbie was the first high concept fantasy comedy to be given the blockbuster treatment in ages. Oppenheimer was an arthouse biopic given the blockbuster treatment. Those two hark back to the star-driven Hollywood blockbusters of the 90s like Forrest Gump which were more about story than action and effects. But it's been so long to see films like that have a mass audience that it feels new and different today. Mario and Freddy's are video game adaptations which is a genre that still feels fresh.

Barbie and Oppenheimer had critically acclaimed directors who were able to have full control of their movies unlike most blockbusters which seem to be made by committee. This is all of MCU, Indiana Jones, Flash etc. Only mild surprise was MI7 disappointing despite very strong reviews. But that franchise has a clear ceiling and I thought they went overboard making a 3 hr action flick.