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 "Self Identification" vs "Cultural appropriation"? 
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So much has happened to me that I don’t understand
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Post Re: "Self Identification" vs "Cultural appropriation"?
There is clearly a bigger difference between sexes than race biologically, so I agree with Malcolm that you can't really find an excuse to be outraged at Rachel while being a full trans supporter.

For example many of the things that we separate by sex like bathrooms, sports, etc. were once divided by race as well, and we have since decided that it was racist to do so. We're allowed to identify as having attraction to either the opposite sex or same sex, and the latter can have parades to celebrate the latter - imagine how unacceptable if people only attracted to black people identified as it or had a parade celebrating it? Society has correctly determined that man v woman is a bigger gap than skin colour.


Mon Jun 08, 2020 10:47 am
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Indiana Jones IV
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Post Re: "Self Identification" vs "Cultural appropriation"?
Hey look, a response that actually put some thought into things instead of patting yourself on the back for being so woke ;) Even though we don't agree on several things I appreciate your ability to not behave like several others here, who seem genuinely unable/unwilling to engage in civil discourse. I'm not surprised by the complete lack of reasonable argument from certain folks, as this isn't my first rodeo, but it's still a shame that some don't seem to know that a discussion forum is for discussing things.

An echo chamber seems more like what several people here would prefer to participate in :thumbsup:


Mon Jun 08, 2020 2:13 pm
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So much has happened to me that I don’t understand
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Post Re: "Self Identification" vs "Cultural appropriation"?
Malcolm wrote:
Hey look, a response that actually put some thought into things instead of patting yourself on the back for being so woke ;) Even though we don't agree on several things I appreciate your ability to not behave like several others here, who seem genuinely unable/unwilling to engage in civil discourse. I'm not surprised by the complete lack of reasonable argument from certain folks, as this isn't my first rodeo, but it's still a shame that some don't seem to know that a discussion forum is for discussing things.

An echo chamber seems more like what several people here would prefer to participate in :thumbsup:


Honestly compared to everywhere else on the internet right now this forum does well for allowing different perspectives.

Mob mentality/emotion driven responses/bullying has taken over political discourse on the internet right now.


Mon Jun 08, 2020 2:56 pm
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Indiana Jones IV
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Post Re: "Self Identification" vs "Cultural appropriation"?
That's true in regards to these forums themselves, which I appreciate. I've been a member other places where they simply block/ban/etc *anything* a moderator perceives to be "negative" which varied greatly depending on the moderator's particular views.

Personally, whenever masses of people get together for any purpose I'll either bunker down somewhere or head the other direction--tons of people all together often result in mob mentality situations and no thank you, pass. I prefer discussion, civil discourse, debate, voting your interests (including/especially at the local level), and crazy backwards things like that.

I’ll also say that people are going a little overboard with descriptors that nobody could guess by looking at you or that simply don't apply and then calling it bigotry/hate the “right” word wasn’t used--for example, a person who’s born a female but identifies as male and chooses to dress/act as they understand “male” to be without any biological alterations while being sexually attracted to women who identifies as a “trans man.” That’s not a hypothetical, by the way--that’s a real person I know (well, knew). Until fairly recent history that person would have been a lesbian (a female sexually attracted to females), but now they’re a straight man because they say so? Huh what? Simply dressing and acting as one perceives a "man" to be isn't actually becoming a physical male. I could dress female and act as I understand "female" to be all I want, but that doesn't actually make me a female.


Mon Jun 08, 2020 3:29 pm
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Post Re: "Self Identification" vs "Cultural appropriation"?
delete


Mon Jun 08, 2020 4:13 pm
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Indiana Jones IV
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Post Re: "Self Identification" vs "Cultural appropriation"?
What also drives me up the wall are these headlines you see everywhere simply describing JK Rowling's "transphobic" tweets "mocking" transgenders when that just isn't the situation--it's clickbait bloggers pushing what they know sells, reality be damned. I wonder how many people will actually read *what she said* instead of what a bunch of headlines/poorly researched articles erroneously spew into the world. As you've said, this is a complicated issue that requires adult discussions except a good chunk of people just want to pat themselves on the back for declaring "I support trans!" as if that statement in and of itself is the first & last thing that needs to be said on the matter--all done. Somebody pointing out that women born as females are, in fact, different than trans women and shouldn't be lumped together as if they're the same isn't being transphobic--they're just living in reality.


Last edited by Malcolm on Sun Aug 02, 2020 12:27 am, edited 1 time in total.



Mon Jun 08, 2020 6:30 pm
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Indiana Jones IV
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Post Re: "Self Identification" vs "Cultural appropriation"?
Magnus wrote:
Magnus wrote:

The real solution is that no one should give a fuck what JK says because she's just a childrens book writer with no authority on majority of topics.


Stand by this.


The majority of these seemingly endless blog posts, articles, and headlines I see are railing against her so it seems the largest bunch of people who could use this advice are the anti-Rowling Purity Police ;)

If they don't like what she said then ignore her or disagree, but going the CANCEL! route of demanding viewpoints you don't agree with be silenced is a horrible path to take. I can easily see a world where Biden's doing well leading into October/November before some "journalist" (ie blogger) asks him about one of the latest trans issues in the news or GWTW being removed or something in this family and he either:

-botches the response and this same vocal batch of folks decide Biden's not pure enough and encourages writing in your favorite trans person of color for President instead.

-nails the "appropriate" response to not ruffle any feathers which only gives Republicans ammo for one of those divisive social issues ("Do you want a President in favor of denying your biological sex?" "Joe Biden supports censorship of film, what's next?") that often push the fence people who seemingly wait until the morning of to decide who to vote for over to the Republican side.

How does someone on "the left" think systematically excommunicating people via cancel culture, people who *identify as liberal* themselves, will do anything but add votes to the other party or simply encourage people to not participate at all because both parties are nuts?


Wed Jun 10, 2020 6:15 pm
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Post Re: "Self Identification" vs "Cultural appropriation"?
JK Rowling already milked the Harry Potter brand so thoroughly that she's almost un-cancellable in that she already made her money. It's probably why she doesn't give a fuck. Will WB cancel Fantastic Beasts 3 because of this? Only if they're looking for a way out of a franchise that's nowhere near what they hoped for, but I highly doubt it. Other than that, what are they going to do, ban the books? They're one of the biggest cultural phenoms of the last 50 years and there's like half a billion of them lying around in libraries and people's living rooms. And outside of English-speaking countries no one cares about this whatsoever (if anything they would very much support her) and HP has a huge global audience.

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Thu Jun 11, 2020 3:04 am
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The Kramer
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Post Re: "Self Identification" vs "Cultural appropriation"?
JK Rowling is in a rare position where pretty much everyone is mad at her right now. Liberals hate her for transphobia, conservatives hate her for witchcraft and even her die-hard fans are still stung by The Crimes of Grindelwald being shitty.

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Fri Jun 12, 2020 3:56 pm
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Post Re: "Self Identification" vs "Cultural appropriation"?
She has found herself to be in bad-standing with just about everyone.

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Fri Jun 12, 2020 9:44 pm
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So much has happened to me that I don’t understand
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Post Re: "Self Identification" vs "Cultural appropriation"?
Flava'd vs The World wrote:
JK Rowling is in a rare position where pretty much everyone is mad at her right now. Liberals hate her for transphobia, conservatives hate her for witchcraft and even her die-hard fans are still stung by The Crimes of Grindelwald being shitty.


The conservatives don’t actually hate her for witchcraft, those were just the crazies


Sat Jun 13, 2020 12:30 am
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The Kramer
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Post Re: "Self Identification" vs "Cultural appropriation"?
Well then they were probably upset at the Death Eaters being portrayed as bad. All they wanted was to make the Magical World Great Again. Magic should be for magical families only. The Mudbloods, I mean Muggle Borns, they are people too, but need to be kept separated from us good and decent folk who didn't steal our magic. And if the aurors have to rough those thieves up a little bit then so be it. We need to be kept safe.

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Sat Jun 13, 2020 3:17 pm
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Post Re: "Self Identification" vs "Cultural appropriation"?
Not exactly related to this thread (didn't want to make a new one), but the Supreme Court ruled this morning (6-3) that LGBTQ workers are protected from discrimination under the Civil Rights Act. Roberts and Gorsuch joined the majority decision. :thumbsup:

(Although such a decision should have been made decades ago.)

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Mon Jun 15, 2020 11:13 am
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