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i.hope
Defeats all expectations
Joined: Fri May 26, 2006 5:04 pm
Posts: 6665
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 Testing the Great Firewall Have you ever wondered how well internet censorship is working in China? As part of an unofficial Pew international government accountability project, we believe China's government should be held accountable for the well-being of its internet firewall as paid for by taxpayers across the country. If you are located in China, please tell us whether you can access the following media websites (1)over a public network and (2)via VPN. Thank you for your help. USCNN (news network) http://www.cnn.com/New York Times (liberal broadsheet) http://www.nytimes.com/Wall Street Journal (pro-business broadsheet) http://www.wsj.com/Huffingtonpost (liberal internet newspaper) http://www.huffingtonpost.com/reddit (social networking/news forums) http://reddit.com/UKThe Times (conservative paper) http://www.thetimes.co.ukGuardian (liberal paper) http://www.theguardian.com/BBC News (news channel) http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/Hong KongApple Daily (pro-democratic tabloid) http://hk.apple.nextmedia.com/Ming Pao (liberal broadsheet) http://mingpao.com/Post 852 (pro-democratic political news site) http://www.post852.com/Passion Times (local movement website) http://passiontimes.hk/Meme HK (progressive web tv) http://www.memehk.com/HKGolden (social networking/news forums) http://www.hkgolden.com/
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| Sun Aug 31, 2014 3:41 pm |
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Algren
now we know
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2004 9:31 pm
Posts: 68335
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Re: Testing the Great Firewall About 2 months ago, China tightened its censorship and blocked a load more sites. Even Google is unusable now. Before it was fine (typing www.google.com would redirect to its HK site, now you cannot even use that one). _________________STOP UIGHUR GENOCIDE IN XINJIANG
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| Sun Aug 31, 2014 6:22 pm |
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Algren
now we know
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2004 9:31 pm
Posts: 68335
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Re: Testing the Great Firewall Without VPN. I'll try it with VPN later. Although I'm positive that all will be visible. _________________STOP UIGHUR GENOCIDE IN XINJIANG
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| Sun Aug 31, 2014 6:28 pm |
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Algren
now we know
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2004 9:31 pm
Posts: 68335
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Re: Testing the Great Firewall It's the most frustrating thing about my life in China. I just typed www.bing.com (since www.google.com is blocked) and I cannot access that page. Instead it goes directly to the cn.bing.com version where everything is in Chinese text. I changed my preferences to English, UK, English, and English, and it's still all in Chinese. I loathe the way they just force you to do whatever they desire. I mean, what is the legitimate reason for blocking bing.com? _________________STOP UIGHUR GENOCIDE IN XINJIANG
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| Sun Aug 31, 2014 6:53 pm |
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i.hope
Defeats all expectations
Joined: Fri May 26, 2006 5:04 pm
Posts: 6665
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Re: Testing the Great Firewall Algren wrote: About 2 months ago, China tightened its censorship and blocked a load more sites. Even Google is unusable now. Before it was fine (typing http://www.google.com would redirect to its HK site, now you cannot even use that one). google.com was blocked but google.com.hk was okay (for a while)? Interesting.  https://support.google.com/adwordspolicy/answer/1310914?hl=en&ref_topic=1626336So Google thought censoring political ads would help them gain footing in China? Guess not.
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| Sun Aug 31, 2014 8:23 pm |
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Algren
now we know
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2004 9:31 pm
Posts: 68335
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Re: Testing the Great Firewall i.hope wrote: Algren wrote: About 2 months ago, China tightened its censorship and blocked a load more sites. Even Google is unusable now. Before it was fine (typing http://www.google.com would redirect to its HK site, now you cannot even use that one). google.com was blocked but google.com.hk was okay (for a while)? Interesting. Yes. I just tried them again and they are both outright blocked. It seems that no Google site is allowed in China (co.uk, co.jp etc.). _________________STOP UIGHUR GENOCIDE IN XINJIANG
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| Sun Aug 31, 2014 8:29 pm |
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i.hope
Defeats all expectations
Joined: Fri May 26, 2006 5:04 pm
Posts: 6665
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Re: Testing the Great Firewall Algren wrote: Without VPN. I'll try it with VPN later. Although I'm positive that all will be visible. Thanks! CNN is one of the most compliant news outlets out there, no surprise. NYT and WSJ are blocked. That might help explain their increased coverage of Hong Kong affairs. None of the three British sites are blocked. Guess it's part of the dealings between Cameron and Xi. Apple Daily is anti-Communist so no surprise there. Ming Pao started sampling Xinhua (a Chinese state news agency) news articles on its website some years ago. Guess Beijing is still not convinced. Passion Times is anti-Communist and anti-"locust" (a derogatory term for mainlanders who behave rudely). So not really a surprise.
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| Sun Aug 31, 2014 8:40 pm |
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Algren
now we know
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2004 9:31 pm
Posts: 68335
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Re: Testing the Great Firewall They all work with a VPN.
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| Mon Sep 01, 2014 12:19 am |
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i.hope
Defeats all expectations
Joined: Fri May 26, 2006 5:04 pm
Posts: 6665
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Re: Testing the Great Firewall Algren wrote: They all work with a VPN. Thanks. Do many people in China know how to work around the firewall, from your experience?
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| Mon Sep 01, 2014 12:16 pm |
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Algren
now we know
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2004 9:31 pm
Posts: 68335
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Re: Testing the Great Firewall Foreigners do, yes. Chinese people have no idea what a VPN is.
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| Mon Sep 01, 2014 6:27 pm |
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i.hope
Defeats all expectations
Joined: Fri May 26, 2006 5:04 pm
Posts: 6665
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Re: Testing the Great Firewall Algren wrote: Foreigners do, yes. Chinese people have no idea what a VPN is. It appears to me a fair number of people who use facebook and Youtube are from the mainland. They post in Simplified Chinese with syntactic styles unique to places in China. How do they get on fb or yt? Probably through VPN. I wonder how many of them are real people and how many are government trolls.
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| Mon Sep 01, 2014 11:42 pm |
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Algren
now we know
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2004 9:31 pm
Posts: 68335
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Re: Testing the Great Firewall Sure there are Chinese mainlanders that use VPNs. But the main users are foreigners. In general, Chinese people care too much about money, so spending $10 per month on a VPN when they can just get normal Internet without it would seem like a waste of money, especially for people that never experienced FB or YT anyway. For Chinese that studied abroad and came back, I imagine some would use a VPN, but still not a huge percentage. Out of the people that I know that studied abroad and are now back in China, 2 use a VPN. I knew about 30 Chinese.
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| Mon Sep 01, 2014 11:46 pm |
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i.hope
Defeats all expectations
Joined: Fri May 26, 2006 5:04 pm
Posts: 6665
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Re: Testing the Great Firewall $10 in RMB?
I love your generalization about Chinese people caring too much about money. They are "frugal" in a sense. But they are willing to spend a lot when it comes to food and gambling. Another generalization, from me.
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| Tue Sep 02, 2014 12:02 am |
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Algren
now we know
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2004 9:31 pm
Posts: 68335
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Re: Testing the Great Firewall Chinese are willing to spend when there is a potential gain or to impress someone, but they are tight as fuck in general, and always beg for discount and choose the cheapest option for EVERYTHING just so they can save more money at the end of the month (to pay for that car or apartment to impress someone with). If I meant 10 units of RMB, I would have written 10RMB.  _________________STOP UIGHUR GENOCIDE IN XINJIANG
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| Tue Sep 02, 2014 7:36 am |
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i.hope
Defeats all expectations
Joined: Fri May 26, 2006 5:04 pm
Posts: 6665
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Re: Testing the Great Firewall Algren wrote: It's the most frustrating thing about my life in China. I just typed http://www.bing.com (since http://www.google.com is blocked) and I cannot access that page. Instead it goes directly to the cn.bing.com version where everything is in Chinese text. I changed my preferences to English, UK, English, and English, and it's still all in Chinese. I loathe the way they just force you to do whatever they desire. I mean, what is the legitimate reason for blocking bing.com? Does this happen on VPN too? legitimate reason = site propagating "false" information -> threat to national security -> banned in the name of state interest Here the thing with authoritarian rule. The ruling party has or tries to have full control over the state. It would do everything to stop anything that it thinks would pose a threat to its authority. It makes laws at its convenience, then says it does what it does in accordance with the law. Quote: NYT 11/20/2009:
Western corporations have often behaved embarrassingly in China, sacrificing any principles to ingratiate themselves with the Communist Party authorities. Yahoo was the worst, handing over information about several email account holders so that they could be arrested – and then dissembling and defending its monstrous conduct. Now Microsoft is sacrificing the integrity of Bing searches so as to cozy up to State Security in Beijing. In effect, it has chosen become part of the Communist Party’s propaganda apparatus.
If you search a term on Bing that is politically sensitive in China, in English the results are legitimate. Search “Tiananmen” and you’ll find out about the army firing on pro-democracy protesters in 1989. Search Dalai Lama, Falun Gong and you also get credible results. Conduct the search in complex Chinese characters (the kind used in Taiwan and Hong Kong) and on the whole you still get authentic results.
But conduct the search with the simplified characters used in mainland China, then you get sanitized pro-Communist results. This is especially true of image searches. Magic! No Tiananmen Square massacre. The Dalai Lama becomes an oppressor. Falun Gong believers are villains, not victims.
What’s most offensive is that this is true wherever in the world the search is conducted – including in my office in New York. If Microsoft felt it had to bow to Chinese censorship within China’s borders, based on the IP address, that might be defensible. But when Microsoft skews its worldwide searches to make Hu Jintao feel better, that’s a disgrace. It becomes simply a unit of the Central Committee Propaganda Department.
(This is an issue with Google as well, but to a much lesser extent. Google censors results on its search engine used within China, google.cn, but offers mostly uncensored results using simplified Chinese characters on its worldwide browser, google.com. However, some searches on google.com, such as images for Falun Gong, are also censored.) So it seems Bing gets smarter in China and redirects its sites to a version with Chinese characteristic. 
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| Wed Sep 03, 2014 10:20 pm |
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Algren
now we know
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2004 9:31 pm
Posts: 68335
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Re: Testing the Great Firewall i.hope wrote: Algren wrote: It's the most frustrating thing about my life in China. I just typed http://www.bing.com (since http://www.google.com is blocked) and I cannot access that page. Instead it goes directly to the cn.bing.com version where everything is in Chinese text. I changed my preferences to English, UK, English, and English, and it's still all in Chinese. I loathe the way they just force you to do whatever they desire. I mean, what is the legitimate reason for blocking bing.com? Does this happen on VPN too? Nope. It goes straight to the English page (probably UK or US). Great article excerpt, by the way. _________________STOP UIGHUR GENOCIDE IN XINJIANG
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| Wed Sep 03, 2014 11:35 pm |
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